RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave alone.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/14/2008 9:31:58 PM
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lightshineon
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If the shoe was on the other foot, and I ran into a stall-less bathroom, and Fred was doing something in that bathroom, and I pulled my pants down exposing my woman-hood, saying "you could stay Fred, and close you eyes if you want to? "While old Fred was running out, as fast as he could. Would people think I was being sexualy inappropriate? I am sure Freds' wife would think so.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/14/2008 9:35:13 PM
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Kath
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light, exposing himself to you would be a crime, I'd think.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/14/2008 9:39:09 PM
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lightshineon
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My word agianst his, but I now carry a knife, and know where self locking rooms are in the creepy building.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Kath
light, exposing himself to you would be a crime, I'd think.
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Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/14/2008 10:12:03 PM
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mrtigger
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
If the shoe was on the other foot, and I ran into a stall-less bathroom, and Fred was doing something in that bathroom, and I pulled my pants down exposing my woman-hood, saying "you could stay Fred, and close you eyes if you want to? "While old Fred was running out, as fast as he could. Would people think I was being sexualy inappropriate? I am sure Freds' wife would think so.
If you believe he committed a crime or was sexually harassing you, report it to the polic or HR.
I think it's one of those things you got to be there to really understand it. And I wasn't there so I can't really say. The guys behaviour could be anywhere from criminal to just him innocently fumbling the situation.
Personally, I would be caught off guard finding a woman in the men's room and probably could not think very quickly and clearly about the situation. I could picture my self saying something stupid in that situation. I think my reaction would probably be just to leave though.
But one thing that strikes me as odd though is that you could not have been in there very long... Putting literature in there would take a minute or so tops I think. Right? And he just happened to walk in right then??? Maybe so but that strikes me as a bit too coincidental....
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/14/2008 11:15:22 PM
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agapetos
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quote:
But one thing that strikes me as odd though is that you could not have been in there very long... Putting literature in there would take a minute or so tops I think I admit, that confused me too, given that light had blocked the door open. I confess, I wouldn't have blocked the door open. (Light, I don't disbelieve what you are saying, but the picture isn't really clear to me.) But then, I would have considered carefully whether I needed to take the reading matter into the toilets. Women don't have reading matter in there. If they need something to read, they could easily collect it from a small table outside of the toilets.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 7:18:07 AM
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zamdad
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At this time, Light, document the incident (as you have here). If another incident occurs, report it along with this one. I don't think you need to worry about being raped by Fred. He sounds more like someone trying to set up an opportunity. My guess is that he's probably done the same thing to other women. Be careful with the knife, don't become the next Lorena Bobbit.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 7:46:20 AM
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Kath
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quote:
ORIGINAL: agapetos
quote:
But one thing that strikes me as odd though is that you could not have been in there very long... Putting literature in there would take a minute or so tops I think I admit, that confused me too, given that light had blocked the door open. I confess, I wouldn't have blocked the door open. (Light, I don't disbelieve what you are saying, but the picture isn't really clear to me.)
Aga, now I'm not sure what you mean. For example, I know around here if anyone is cleaning the restrooms they prop the door open. It would be natural then for Light to prop the door open when she went in the restroom designated for another gender.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 11:20:38 AM
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manda59
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Kath
quote:
ORIGINAL: agapetos
quote:
But one thing that strikes me as odd though is that you could not have been in there very long... Putting literature in there would take a minute or so tops I think I admit, that confused me too, given that light had blocked the door open. I confess, I wouldn't have blocked the door open. (Light, I don't disbelieve what you are saying, but the picture isn't really clear to me.)
Aga, now I'm not sure what you mean. For example, I know around here if anyone is cleaning the restrooms they prop the door open. It would be natural then for Light to prop the door open when she went in the restroom designated for another gender.
I understand and agree with what mrtigger and agapetos said. From what she said, lightshineon wasn't in there to clean, just to put newspapers in the stalls. Unless they have more than 2-3 stalls, that wouldn't take longer than a minute or two. Basically a "straight in" and "straight out" scenario.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 11:22:18 AM
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zoebob
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Around here I would still prop the door open.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 11:22:40 AM
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manda59
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
My word agianst his, but I now carry a knife, and know where self locking rooms are in the creepy building.
I don't want to take this offtopic, but in the UK, that would be a criminal offence.
If it was me, I'd carry a whistle (I do already) and if I was really concerned, one of those personal alarm things.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 11:22:50 AM
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mrtigger
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Just to clarify, my suspicion is that the guy waited for you to go in there and then went in knowing he could be obnoxious to you and be able to use he "had to go" as his cover story.
Maybe he did just happen to have to go pee during the few minutes that you were in there. That is possible. But given you were in there for a short time during a period when nearly all employees were gone, makes me suspicous that he may have done it deliberately.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 11:46:58 AM
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manda59
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mrtigger
Just to clarify, my suspicion is that the guy waited for you to go in there and then went in knowing he could be obnoxious to you and be able to use he "had to go" as his cover story.
Maybe he did just happen to have to go pee during the few minutes that you were in there. That is possible. But given you were in there for a short time during a period when nearly all employees were gone, makes me suspicous that he may have done it deliberately.
Though I thought that lightshineon said that he wasn't even normally in the building at that time, so surely he would have been unlikely to know she'd be going in there?
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 12:30:28 PM
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Child4Jesus
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What does whip it out in front of me mean? Even that isn't clear to me. Was he facing the urinal or facing you?
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The greatest heresy to American Christianity is that if you ask Jesus to come into your heart, he definitely will.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 12:36:02 PM
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solo_soprano22
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quote:
ORIGINAL: manda59
quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
My word agianst his, but I now carry a knife, and know where self locking rooms are in the creepy building.
I don't want to take this offtopic, but in the UK, that would be a criminal offence.
If it was me, I'd carry a whistle (I do already) and if I was really concerned, one of those personal alarm things.
I thought it was illegal to do that here as well, but depending on how long the blade is. :) (I'm far from knowing the law, but I saw someone arrested because [she said] the blade was too long.) I thought about getting a gun (after so much has happened to me, the police actually suggested it)... but, that seems too risky to me.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 12:39:17 PM
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solo_soprano22
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Child4Jesus
What does whip it out in front of me mean? Even that isn't clear to me. Was he facing the urinal or facing you?
I was wondering that too... I mean, if he had to go, something would make an appearance soon (but I'd think unless she were very close or in a specific position it's possible not to see anything). If he exposed himself blatantly (not to do what he had to do in the restroom), I'd be more suspicious. Perhaps that's what he did though; there's only so much I can get from a post.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 1:40:43 PM
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Child4Jesus
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From: Long Island, Nassau, Elmont, NY
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
My word against his, but I now carry a knife, and know where self locking rooms are in the creepy building.
quote:
ORIGINAL: manda59
I don't want to take this offtopic, but in the UK, that would be a criminal offense. If it was me, I'd carry a whistle (I do already) and if I was really concerned, one of those personal alarm things.
quote:
ORIGINAL: solo_soprano22
I thought it was illegal to do that here as well, but depending on how long the blade is. :) (I'm far from knowing the law, but I saw someone arrested because [she said] the blade was too long.) I thought about getting a gun (after so much has happened to me, the police actually suggested it)... but, that seems too risky to me.
Let me start by saying that if you didn't already know I'm a police officer in the NYPD.
With that being said do not carry a knife for protection. First off depending on where you live I'm sure it is illegal to carry a blade longer than 4 inches. If you get caught with it you can get arrested. Secondly people who carry knifes for protection usually ended up on the receiving end of the knife.
Yes Solo it is too risky. You can carry it provided you always have you carrying/gun license with you. However again people who carry guns for protection when in a situation what requires it get shot.
_____________________________
In Christ,
Richad
The greatest heresy to American Christianity is that if you ask Jesus to come into your heart, he definitely will.
Paul Washer
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 1:49:11 PM
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agapetos
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quote:
Aga, now I'm not sure what you mean. For example, I know around here if anyone is cleaning the restrooms they prop the door open. It would be natural then for Light to prop the door open when she went in the restroom designated for another gender. Sorry Kath, Manda said it well though ~ in addition I'd add this. Part of this could come down to the definition of what a 'girl Friday ' is. Light said she was a 'girl Friday'. Here (and according the the link, there too), a 'girl Friday' is not a cleaner. They're employed to do a bunch of odd jobs within the company. Light (from what I recall) has never said that she cleans the toilets, but was simply asked to take something for the men to read into the toilets.
Urinals are not normally close to the door (so people can't see men as the door opens and closes), stalls often are closer. If that's so in this case, then Light should have had the opportunity to leave the toilet before the man started to unzip himself ~ unless he started that outside or the second he came into the toilet (and having seen women with hands on waistbands to do similar when they've gone into pubic toilets) I wouldn't say that's too unusual.
Again, I'm sorry, the way Light has explained things is not very clear.
If you are feeling that unsafe at work, that you need to carry a knife, you need to do something. You could go to your supervisor and tell them politely that you do not feel comfortable about going into the men's toilets to deliver their reading stuff to the stalls because someone came in when you were in there recently and it's upset you terribly. You don't need to give any names, you don't need to make any accusations. You can simply say you were upset.
If you were there to clean then you need to ask your supervisor for a sign that states the toilets you are in are being cleaned and can men please use another one, or something similar to this.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 1:57:56 PM
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Zhi
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I would say that mace/pepper spray with a whistle/air horn is probably far more useful than a knife.
For one thing it won't do permanent damage if it gets turned against you.
For another, it's really difficult for a physically less powerful person to properly use a knife against a physically more powerful person, without some serious training. For that matter, it's somewhat difficult to use a knife even if you're physically equal or more powerful, if the person is in "fight or flight" mode and you have not been trained. It's difficult to debilitate a person when you're using a knife (there's not really any "stopping power" if they're unimpressed with the initial display of aggression, which an aggressive man toward a smaller female will generally not be impressed), and in the meantime it will mostly make them angry and more violent.
If you're going to get some serious training, you might consider self defense classes instead of knife fighting classes, and carry mace/pepper spray and a whistle/air horn/phone with 911 on speed dial in the meantime. The idea is that you want him to be debilitated so the aggression cannot continue, and mace/pepper spray and the knowledge that someone is probably coming to back you up is a far more effective debilitation technique than trying to use a knife. Self-defense classes will also teach ways to effectively debilitate.
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RE: Is this sexual harassment, or something to leave al... - 9/15/2008 2:16:01 PM
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agapetos
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quote:
I would say that mace/pepper spray with a whistle/air horn is probably far more useful than a knife. It's illegal to use pepper spray here. It may be worth checking into whether it's ok to use it in the state you live in, and in the company that you work for.
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