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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 5:41:43 AM
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ljmac
Posts: 1419
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
quote:
ORIGINAL: ljmac
Save us money by taking it from us. Good plan.
Ah, I see you are one of those people who thinks that money grows on trees and that $9.6 Trillion national debt is nothing to worry about, because the government can always turn on the printing press.
A debt that is roughly three times the federal budget is not sustainable. We need to start paying it down, not increasing it.
Send your own money in and leave the rest of us alone.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 9:00:52 AM
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saved9201
Posts: 714
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I fear McCain because with his selection of Palin, he confirmed that he'll say and do anything it takes to win. That thought first occurred to me during the Rick Warren interview, when asked who he would go to for advice, he mentioned without much hesitation a woman (Meg Whitman), a military man (Gen. Petraeus), and a black (John Lewis). Yeah, right. As the SNL church lady would say, "How con - veeeeeeeeeen - yent." I don't trust him, I don't believe him, he's not a Christian, he could be lying about everything but since he does it sincerely and with conviction, some of you are convinced he's one of you. I think he's a big phony opportunist who seens his political clock ticking down and has become dangerously desperate.
- Julius
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 11:27:37 AM
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ljmac
Posts: 1419
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quote:
ORIGINAL: saved9201
I fear McCain because with his selection of Palin, he confirmed that he'll say and do anything it takes to win. That thought first occurred to me during the Rick Warren interview, when asked who he would go to for advice, he mentioned without much hesitation a woman (Meg Whitman), a military man (Gen. Petraeus), and a black (John Lewis). Yeah, right. As the SNL church lady would say, "How con - veeeeeeeeeen - yent." I don't trust him, I don't believe him, he's not a Christian, he could be lying about everything but since he does it sincerely and with conviction, some of you are convinced he's one of you. I think he's a big phony opportunist who seens his political clock ticking down and has become dangerously desperate.
- Julius
The reason McCain has taken so long to get where he is is because he has refused to make himself a political opportunist. About a year ago he was written off as a candidate largely because of his refusal to pander to the conservative base. From illegal aliens to campaign finance reform to tax policy, McCain repeatedly took contrary positions that alienated the base.
Eight years ago Joseph Lieberman was the Democratic VP candidate. Today he is a joyful supporter of John McCain. You don't make alliances like that by being interested only in oneself.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 11:53:23 AM
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saved9201
Posts: 714
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quote:
About a year ago he was written off as a candidate largely because of his refusal to pander to the conservative base.
So he learned his lesson, now he does (pander) and I rest my case
- Julius
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 11:58:03 AM
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blessedinnyc
Posts: 1964
Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: ljmac
Send your own money in and leave the rest of us alone.
No. You need to stop borrowing on my behalf. The US has the only credit card that I can't take my name off of as a cosigner.
Worst of all, that debt is piling up at a rate that is faster than our current deficit. Am I the only one here who still cares about financial responsibility?
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 12:01:09 PM
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wing2000
Posts: 1035
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McCain's first major decision of his would-be Presidency (selection of his VP) certainly does not inspire confidence.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 12:06:35 PM
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ljmac
Posts: 1419
Joined: 11/20/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
quote:
ORIGINAL: ljmac
Send your own money in and leave the rest of us alone.
No. You need to stop borrowing on my behalf. The US has the only credit card that I can't take my name off of as a cosigner.
Worst of all, that debt is piling up at a rate that is faster than our current deficit. Am I the only one here who still cares about financial responsibility?
Live up to your boasting and send the government a check. From your own account.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 12:08:00 PM
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ljmac
Posts: 1419
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quote:
ORIGINAL: wing2000
McCain's first major decision of his would-be Presidency (selection of his VP) certainly does not inspire confidence.
The Republicans have a right side up ticket. The Democrat's is upside down.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 12:49:26 PM
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blessedinnyc
Posts: 1964
Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: ljmac
Live up to your boasting and send the government a check. From your own account.
I've already done that. I own many of the T-Notes that the government has written on my behalf. If and when the government defaults, at the very least, China won't be able to blame me for the problem.
Now that I've done this, maybe you should, too. Our dependence on China will continue until everyone does this- or until we decide to raise taxes to the point that our government can live within its means.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 1:09:15 PM
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tafkam
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quote:
McCain's first major decision of his would-be Presidency (selection of his VP) certainly does not inspire confidence.
So it's perfectly acceptable for the Democrats to put up a liberal ticket but somehow inappropriate for the GOP to put up a conservative ticket.
Just making sure I got that straight...
_____________________________
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
Tafkam
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 4:31:25 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2752
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From: Raleigh, NC
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quote:
or until we decide to raise taxes to the point that our government can live within its means.
Why can't the government simply decide to live within its means? End all government subsidies such as the National Endowment for the Arts, PBS, NPR, etc. End all government departments except for those dictated by the Constitution (Defense and State).
Last year the NC state government had a two billion dollar surplus and blew it on things such as a Teapot Museum. This year they added a John Coltrane Museum
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 4:35:59 PM
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iluvatar
Posts: 1939
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quote:
ORIGINAL: colliefan
quote:
or until we decide to raise taxes to the point that our government can live within its means.
Why can't the government simply decide to live within its means? End all government subsidies such as the National Endowment for the Arts, PBS, NPR, etc. End all government departments except for those dictated by the Constitution (Defense and State).
How much money does the federal government give every year to those organizations?
-Dan.
_____________________________
Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 4:58:53 PM
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todd_t
Posts: 1571
Joined: 6/21/2006
From: The North Woods
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quote:
So it's perfectly acceptable for the Democrats to put up a liberal ticket but somehow inappropriate for the GOP to put up a conservative ticket.
I don't think it's a question of ideology. McCain can put whomever he wants on the GOP ticket (although Lieberman was his first choice).
Yet the fact that McCain had spoken to Palin only twice before selecting her comes across to some as stunt casting to persuade Hillary voters to vote for him.
Now, that's hardly illegal. In fact, I think it's a shrewd move by McCain.
However, I think after the luster of Sarah Palin's sudden emergence dies down, McCain stands to lose as much edge as he might have gained by going with Romney or Pawlenty - especially when Palin's rigid pro-life views may badly alienate moderate women voters.
In general, politicians telling women voters they feel an abortion should be off-limits after being raped is not a good way to endear themselves to the public.
_____________________________
In Memoriam: 1st Sgt. Obediah Kolath, US Army, Died in Iraq War (1973-2005)
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 5:22:44 PM
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ljmac
Posts: 1419
Joined: 11/20/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
quote:
ORIGINAL: ljmac
Live up to your boasting and send the government a check. From your own account.
I've already done that. I own many of the T-Notes that the government has written on my behalf. If and when the government defaults, at the very least, China won't be able to blame me for the problem.
Now that I've done this, maybe you should, too. Our dependence on China will continue until everyone does this- or until we decide to raise taxes to the point that our government can live within its means.
No, send the government a check and don't expect it back plus interest. What you do is the same as what China does.
Did you really say, "...raise taxes to the point that our government can live within its means"? Might as well feed obese people until they don't want any more.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 7:12:17 PM
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blessedinnyc
Posts: 1964
Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: ljmac
No, send the government a check and don't expect it back plus interest.
But if I paid taxes- at the same rate everyone else did- to help lower the deficit, we'd all get the money back, plus interest (in the form of lower taxes in the future).
quote:
What you do is the same as what China does.
So in other words, saving money, rather than borrowing it?
quote:
Did you really say, "...raise taxes to the point that our government can live within its means"? Might as well feed obese people until they don't want any more.
In our government's current state, the fat represents the billowing $9.6 Trillion debt. To reduce the fat, we would have to do something inconvenient; exercise (raise taxes) or eat less (cut spending).
I am advocating both, which includes raising taxes.
Perhaps a better analogy would be a supply-sider. The supply-sider works 20 hours a week and has run up a lot of credit card debt. Reagan told him he can make more money working 20 hours a week than he would if he worked 40.
The supply sider is now working about seven or eight hours a week just to pay off his debt. One thing he needs to do is cut spending, but he won't have enough to live on if he also wants to pay off his credit cards. Thus, he needs to get a real job and work 40 hours a week like responsible people do.
< Message edited by blessedinnyc -- 8/30/2008 7:25:17 PM >
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/30/2008 10:56:04 PM
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Matt Smith
Posts: 59
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: Austin, TX
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My fear is that he isn't reliable and can act rashly.
Obviously he's famous for his temper. I don't have a lot of respect for people who blow up easily. And it doesn't inspire my confidence in his ability to handle a crisis or conflict situation.
He seems to really buy into the macho George W Bush policy of shoot first, think later. He was ready to invade Iraq before it was even an issue. His aggressive posturing with Russia also seemed a little silly. I don't think personal egos should be part of our foreign policy.
The VP choice also seems very rash. If I had to pick the Vice President of the US - someone who might become Commander-in-Chief of the world's most powerful military - I would never, ever pick someone I'd only met once before at some conference. I mean, I go to more trouble than that when I'm hiring an employee for a small nonprofit! I can't believe he picked her without more to go on, a thorough process of getting to know her and what makes her tick.
Finally - I don't consider him reliable in terms of his politics. 8 years ago, he righteously objected when W's people smeared him. But now he's using the same people to smear Obama. He used to oppose wartime tax cuts, but he changed his tune. Flip-flopped on his immigration policy and his views on climate change. Used to call Christian conservatives "agents of intolerance," and now he's picked Palin as his running-mate. He's all over the place. It's hard to trust where he actually stands anymore.
So, again - my biggest fear is, I don't know what to expect from him, and I don't trust him to make good, rational decisions.
Matt
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/31/2008 1:38:23 AM
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ljmac
Posts: 1419
Joined: 11/20/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Matt Smith
My fear is that he isn't reliable and can act rashly.
Obviously he's famous for his temper. I don't have a lot of respect for people who blow up easily. And it doesn't inspire my confidence in his ability to handle a crisis or conflict situation.
He seems to really buy into the macho George W Bush policy of shoot first, think later. He was ready to invade Iraq before it was even an issue. His aggressive posturing with Russia also seemed a little silly. I don't think personal egos should be part of our foreign policy.
The VP choice also seems very rash. If I had to pick the Vice President of the US - someone who might become Commander-in-Chief of the world's most powerful military - I would never, ever pick someone I'd only met once before at some conference. I mean, I go to more trouble than that when I'm hiring an employee for a small nonprofit! I can't believe he picked her without more to go on, a thorough process of getting to know her and what makes her tick.
Finally - I don't consider him reliable in terms of his politics. 8 years ago, he righteously objected when W's people smeared him. But now he's using the same people to smear Obama. He used to oppose wartime tax cuts, but he changed his tune. Flip-flopped on his immigration policy and his views on climate change. Used to call Christian conservatives "agents of intolerance," and now he's picked Palin as his running-mate. He's all over the place. It's hard to trust where he actually stands anymore.
So, again - my biggest fear is, I don't know what to expect from him, and I don't trust him to make good, rational decisions.
Matt
You're full of misrepresentations. McCain has been in more "crisis situations" than people can possibly imagine and has performed supremly.
He has had to eject from fighter planes, escape from another that had sunk to the ocean floor, was hit by shrapnel and survived one of the most horrific fires ever to take place on a US carrier. And those situations were easy compared to what came later as he endured years of a "conflict situation" at the hands of the communist Vietnamese.
After his plane was shot, he ejected and broke one knee and both arms and nearly drowned. Then he was speared repeatedly by the scummy people who found him. The commies put him in solitary confinement for more than two years. No windows, two small holes for ventilation and a tin roof just inches above his head. That psychological test proved his mental and emotional fitness far beyond anything he'll find in the oval office.
Add to his solitary confinement beatings that broke multiple bones, such little food that his weight dropped below 100 pounds, and visits from American traitors (liberals) who used them for Communist propoganda.
In a PR move the communists asked McCain if he'd like to go home. He said no, he wouldn't cooperate. They asked again. He said no. They asked again. He said no. They said now you're really going it and things got a lot worse.
Then when he got home, fellow American spit on his buddies.
McCain has endured mental and physical tests beyond your capacity to understand. Your disrespect reflects poorly on your character.
The rest of your post is equally disassociated with the truth. After years of Iraq's refusal to cooperate with weapons inspectors, weapon strikes ordered by Bill Clinton, months of debate in the USA, war approval granted by the US House and the US senate, you characterize Bush's actions as "shoot first." That is not the truth.
I hope your non-profit isn't a Christian organization.
What kind of "crisis situation" had Barak Obama gone through? People might find out that he went to a church that hates America?
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/31/2008 8:29:14 AM
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Thessa
Posts: 811
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Matt Smith
My fear is that he isn't reliable and can act rashly.
Obviously he's famous for his temper. I don't have a lot of respect for people who blow up easily. And it doesn't inspire my confidence in his ability to handle a crisis or conflict situation.
Matt
Tell me something...whats Obama famous for? Oh yeah we dont know. He hasnt been around long enough.
If you say his speeches, well sure - but is that enough of a reason to vote him into office? I would think not.
Obama has not even been a Senator 3 years yet.
Voting him into office at such a critical time for the USA would be like walking into a line of fire with a smile on your face.
Do you know a thing about Obama's demeanor? No you dont because guess what?...He hasnt been around long enough. Have we seen how he reacts to conflict? Nope. Because alot of people think hes some kind of 'God'. Which is sick to begin with.
The fact of the matter is even though McCain isnt perfect (and neither is anyone else) at least we KNOW something about him. We know nothing about Obama except what he wants us to know.
Oh yeah - and the fact that he went to church for 20 years listening to a pastor that is racist and uses the GD word.
Thats one thing we do know for sure.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/31/2008 8:50:58 AM
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Rufas2000
Posts: 1301
Joined: 4/12/2005
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quote:
McCain has endured mental and physical tests beyond your capacity to understand. Your disrespect reflects poorly on your character.
So you're saying he's a bad person because he questioned McCain's ability to lead this country? The poster you are responding to never once questioned McCain's military service or POW experience. He simply feels that McCain will not handle the types of crisis situations that might come up in the White House, which are different than the ones he faced in the military. I strongly disagree with him but I won't question his character because of that opinion. Its not disrespectful to say I don't think this person will be a good president.
BTW: What McCain endured is beyond just about all our capacities to understand.
_____________________________
Be my friend!
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/31/2008 9:00:29 AM
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huangshan
Posts: 727
Joined: 8/6/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
quote:
ORIGINAL: Matt Smith
My fear is that he isn't reliable and can act rashly.
Obviously he's famous for his temper. I don't have a lot of respect for people who blow up easily. And it doesn't inspire my confidence in his ability to handle a crisis or conflict situation.
Matt
Tell me something...whats Obama famous for? Oh yeah we dont know. He hasnt been around long enough.
If you say his speeches, well sure - but is that enough of a reason to vote him into office? I would think not.
Obama has not even been a Senator 3 years yet.
Voting him into office at such a critical time for the USA would be like walking into a line of fire with a smile on your face.
Do you know a thing about Obama's demeanor? No you dont because guess what?...He hasnt been around long enough. Have we seen how he reacts to conflict? Nope. Because alot of people think hes some kind of 'God'. Which is sick to begin with.
The fact of the matter is even though McCain isnt perfect (and neither is anyone else) at least we KNOW something about him. We know nothing about Obama except what he wants us to know.
Oh yeah - and the fact that he went to church for 20 years listening to a pastor that is racist and uses the GD word.
Thats one thing we do know for sure.
Obama is famous for a number of things. His oratory capabilities and speechifying tend to be the first things people notice.
Lesser known is that he was the first black president of the Harvard Law Review, which worked into his writing Dreams from my Father, a personal memoir. It should be noted that he wrote this himself, without the use of a ghost as many politicians are wont to do. The same goes to his followup book, The Audacity of Hope. I would suggest that the ability to manifest one's ideas on paper is a strong indicator of clarity of vision and purpose, but I am of course biased. I do feel that this is an important characteristic, however, and speaks of his intelligence.
Contrary to what you say Obama has been a U.S. senator for over three years. He also served in the state senate of Illinois for eight years... hm.
Really, if you care to educate yourself on the candidates, there's a wealth of information out there. Contrary to what you suggest, I think one of the defining characteristics of modern elections is the sheer amount of information that voters are confronted with. If you have the internet, interest in your country, and a little time, I don't see how one can justify being ignorant of politicians these days.
I am afraid of McCain specifically because of his record. He errs on the side of personal publicity over coherent policy views and war over diplomacy, and that's a dangerous mix. I fear that he will be worse for America than Bush.
< Message edited by huangshan -- 8/31/2008 10:10:31 AM >
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/31/2008 10:03:33 AM
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saved9201
Posts: 714
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: huangshan
quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
quote:
ORIGINAL: Matt Smith
My fear is that he isn't reliable and can act rashly.
Obviously he's famous for his temper. I don't have a lot of respect for people who blow up easily. And it doesn't inspire my confidence in his ability to handle a crisis or conflict situation.
Matt
Tell me something...whats Obama famous for? Oh yeah we dont know. He hasnt been around long enough.
If you say his speeches, well sure - but is that enough of a reason to vote him into office? I would think not.
Obama has not even been a Senator 3 years yet.
Voting him into office at such a critical time for the USA would be like walking into a line of fire with a smile on your face.
Do you know a thing about Obama's demeanor? No you dont because guess what?...He hasnt been around long enough. Have we seen how he reacts to conflict? Nope. Because alot of people think hes some kind of 'God'. Which is sick to begin with.
The fact of the matter is even though McCain isnt perfect (and neither is anyone else) at least we KNOW something about him. We know nothing about Obama except what he wants us to know.
Oh yeah - and the fact that he went to church for 20 years listening to a pastor that is racist and uses the GD word.
Thats one thing we do know for sure.
Obama is famous for a number of things. His oratory capabilities and speechifying tend to be the first things people notice.
Lesser known is that he was the first black president of the Harvard Law Review, which worked into his writing Dreams from my Father, a personal memoir. It should be noted that he wrote this himself, without the use of a ghost as many politicians are wont to do. The same goes to his followup book, The Audacity of Hope. I would suggest that the ability to manifest one's ideas on paper is a strong indicator of clarity of vision and purpose, but I am of course biased. I do feel that this is am important characteristic, however, and speaks of his intelligence.
Contrary to what you say Obama has been a U.S. senator for over three years. He also served in the state senate of Illinois for eight years... hm.
Really, if you care to educate yourself on the candidates, there's a wealth of information out there. Contrary to what you suggest, I think one of the defining characteristics of modern elections is the sheer amount of information that voters are confronted with. If you have the internet, interest in your country, and a little time, I don't see how one can justify being ignorant of politicians these days.
I am afraid of McCain specifically because of his record. He errs on the side of personal publicity over coherent policy views and war over diplomacy, and that's a dangerous mix. I fear that he will be worse for America than Bush.
-Julius
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/31/2008 10:23:34 AM
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Thessa
Posts: 811
Status: offline
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quote:
Obama is famous for a number of things. His oratory capabilities and speechifying tend to be the first things people notice.
Lesser known is that he was the first black president of the Harvard Law Review, which worked into his writing Dreams from my Father, a personal memoir. It should be noted that he wrote this himself, without the use of a ghost as many politicians are wont to do. The same goes to his followup book, The Audacity of Hope. I would suggest that the ability to manifest one's ideas on paper is a strong indicator of clarity of vision and purpose, but I am of course biased. I do feel that this is an important characteristic, however, and speaks of his intelligence.
Contrary to what you say Obama has been a U.S. senator for over three years. He also served in the state senate of Illinois for eight years... hm.
Really, if you care to educate yourself on the candidates, there's a wealth of information out there. Contrary to what you suggest, I think one of the defining characteristics of modern elections is the sheer amount of information that voters are confronted with. If you have the internet, interest in your country, and a little time, I don't see how one can justify being ignorant of politicians these days.
GOOD! Im proud. Now tell me why any of those things qualify him to be President. Make up something else that justifies voting for this man.
Ill bet you looked half of what you just wrote on the internet anyways. So look on Wickipedia and tell me some more.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/31/2008 10:33:30 AM
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huangshan
Posts: 727
Joined: 8/6/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
Ill bet you looked half of what you just wrote on the internet anyways.
That's what people tend to do.
I thought, at least. Or... am I the only non-psychic here?
...
Here, six word reason to support Obama over McCain:
Obama is smart, McCain is not.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/31/2008 10:35:38 AM
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Thessa
Posts: 811
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: huangshan
quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
Ill bet you looked half of what you just wrote on the internet anyways.
That's what people tend to do.
I thought, at least. Or... am I the only non-psychic here?
...
Here, six word reason to support Obama over McCain:
Obama is smart, McCain is not.
I think u just prooved my point for me.
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RE: Why I Fear McCain - 8/31/2008 10:54:54 AM
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sue244
Posts: 439
Joined: 6/7/2006
From: Colorado
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: huangshan
quote:
ORIGINAL: Thessa
Ill bet you looked half of what you just wrote on the internet anyways.
That's what people tend to do.
I thought, at least. Or... am I the only non-psychic here?
...
Here, six word reason to support Obama over McCain:
Obama is smart, McCain is not.
Could we please come up with a different insult for Republicans besides that they are unintelligent. It was overused long before President Bush took office.
_____________________________
"Indeed I Tremble for this country when I reflect that God is Just and His Justice cannot Sleep Forever"
Jefferson
"Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy.” Churchill
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