Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or Help Him?!?!
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[Poll]
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Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or Help Him?!?!
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| Get over it and let God use him like he is. |
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| You're the one with the issue, not him. |
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| By all means, help him improve his speech and ministry! |
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| Ask him how he feels about it and help only if he wants it. |
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| Just keep praying & believe that God will change him if it's HIS will. |
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| If it doesn't bother him, it shouldn't bother you. |
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Total Votes : 12
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(last vote on : 8/22/2008 7:39:47 AM)
(Poll will run till: -- )
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Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or Help H... - 8/18/2008 5:01:15 AM
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pianofirstlady
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 Hey, I'm new here and not sure if I'm posting in the right place, but here goes: I'm 36 and my 33 y-o fiance is a pastor at a small church. While I love him dearly, I have and show the utmost respect for him at all times, I'm torn about my concern for his speech impediment. It's hard to describe - it's not stuttering at all, just an ill-formation of lots of his words that make him appear "slow." I'm no speech pathologist, but it's like his tongue needs to be retrained in the formation of certain words and sounds. It honestly almost hindered me from giving "us" a chance. And it's not so bad that a good speech therapist couldn't help him, but I want to get counsel from a multitude of godly men (and women) before I even think about bringing it up. He pastors my parents' church in a rural area (I live 2 hours away in a major city), and we've been dating since Feb. but have known each other a few years now. While we're usually really good about bringing up - and receiving - suggestions and constructive criticism from one another, this is a tricky one. One day he shared with me how early in his ministry, he attempted to sing after he was done with the sermon. His siblings and cousins had attended and afterwards they all laughed and said in so many words "man you did great 'til you started singing!" He laughs about now, but admits that he hasn't sang from the pulpit since! And as a musician and singer that saddens me. I've heard him sing in the car and I think he has a wonderful voice that has great singing potential. And I told him that. So now he only sings around me.  But that episode with his family is part of the reason I hesitate to say anything about the speech thing. I admire him for answering his calling and going forth in boldness, but sometimes I can sense that he's somewhat self-conscious about his speech himself. It's like the big elephant in the living room that maybe if he doesn't make an issue of it, it'll go away - or nobody will really notice. The saddest part about it all is that he's surrounded by a legion of "brothers in the ministry", many of whom he's known for years - in a huge denomination that's supposedly a "connectional" church. It angers me that they "cheese" in his face and get together hand-shaking and back slapping but none of them have loved him enough to take him aside and offer to help him in this area. They should all be able to help each other grow and hold each other accountable. What else is the "connection" for...just for the politics, bureaucracy and to make the head Bishop rich? Don't get me started on that!
But as far as it concerns me as his fiance - at what point do you stop letting a person that you love so much think that everything's hunky dorey at the expense of their growth and improvement?!?! To be honest, some of its an impediment and some of its just lazy/bad speaking patterns from the environment he grew up in! Stuff like "anuddah" for "another." Ok, did I just give away our race?!?! LOL! Seriously though, even as blacks, in our household Ebonics were NOT acceptable...but then again my mom was a teacher so we got corrected at every turn. And while I understand that he didn't grow up with that privilege, if the tables were turned, heck I'd want him to lovingly approach me concerning my speech and help me get better. It's not like he lacks for intelligence. He's a VERY smart man. Quick thinker and quite the math whiz, and I'm eternally grateful at how God's gives blesses you with someone who's strengths make up for your weaknesses. I can't remember a math class that I ever made higher than a C in!  So he's the "numbers" and money man in the relationship and I'm more the language arts/communication strength. I say this to say that I KNOW he's capable of improving. But because I'm scared to bring it up, I don't know whether his teachers in the past ever suggested or sent him to speech therapy or what.
Granted, I'd still love him if he never did a thing about it, but I don't want to let it fester and then get married and it become a bigger deal. I do have to admit that when we visit more progressive churches with mostly articulate people or get around my family and friends - who I must say are by and large very well spoken people - I'm sometimes embarrassed. And then I'm left to struggle with whether it's a vanity/image thing in MY head or do I genuinely want help for HIM. I'd like to believe it's mostly the latter. The greatest concerns for me as he grows in ministry is (1) him being understood - and yes, there are whole phrases and sentences that often get garbled when he attempts to talk too fast or the thoughts are flowing quicker than he can get the words out. Sometimes when we're talking on the phone, I get frustrated when I have to ask him to keep repeating stuff. But I make sure I don't come off snappy, intolerant or impatient about it. And concern no. (2) is for the children we plan to have. BIG CONCERN FOR ME! Children learn to speak based on what they hear, and I'd have a stone hissy fit if my lil' 2-year-old ever asked me "Mommy, can I have anuddah piece of chicken?" "No, Darling, and you can't eat at this table again until you can properly pronounce 'another'!" Ok, I'm joking. That's terribly harsh, but it gives you some idea about how important it is for me. Which leads me to a major detail I left out - his mom has almost the IDENTICAL speech impediment he has. He was an only child for a while and his parents divorced when he was young, 3, so I'm sure mom's voice was the one he heard more than anyone's. Then again, he has an 11 y-o from his first marriage who has no speech impediment, but he certainly exhibits some of the "lazy" speech patterns where he doesn't finish his words. While I do try to be patient though...I'm a firm believer in kids - and adults - learning to speak "The King's English." But I try to remember that everybody has different value systems and enunciation is obviously not important in the circles they travel in. His son commented to my niece recently that "you tawk lika White gurl!" (Sigh!) But that's a whole 'nother chapter out of another mental book of mine. That leads me to my other big concern - that I'll end up falling into similar speech patterns. And that's scares the mess out of me! I even catch myself now stumbling over or mispronouncing words and I have to analyze whether it's 'cause I'm giving too much thought to this or it's the whole association-assimilation thing at work. Am I subconsciously "dumbing" down my speech and language so they can relate to me and I to them? Arrrrrrrggggghhhh! I'm starting to feel like I need a professional here!
They live in a fairly rural area, but I grew up rural as well, not far from him. I guess the big difference is that I left home at 19 and haven't looked back 'til now. I'm fairly well-traveled and have met and befriended people from all over the globe. He's a whole lot less exposed and so I don't denigrate him or his son for still talking "country" or being unlearned about a lot of stuff. I'm not so far removed that I can't still relate to my "country" roots - which I wouldn't trade for a thing in the world! But I guess I'd just feel better if my fiance' would at least TRY! When he's not working or preaching, he spends a LOT of time in front of his golden big-screen TV. Then on Sun. morning when he's stumbling over Bible words or passages or when thoughts come out incoherent, I feel evil for the thoughts I'm thinking. Like "ok, maybe you could turn off the TV on Sat. nights and on the weekdays when you come home from work and get in front of the mirror or a video camera and read, read and re-read your text. And PRACTICE pronouncing the names and words." But I can't say that...and I never would - not like THAT, at least.
So what gives? Do I just keep ignoring it or find a way to help him? I'm just afraid that if I bring it up, he'll become all the more self-conscious and it'll get WORSE! He's such a great man with a genuine love for God and a greater faith than I've known in any man, despite his affinity for the tube. He always ministering to and encouraging the guys he works with and I only wish I had the boldness he has in that area. I pray a lot - for him and for us and I honestly realize that God often has to change the man in the mirror to accept the way that He's shaped the people we love so much as well as ourselves. It's a thin line though...I do believe God is also concerned with - and a Giver of - our growth and progression. If you're a man in the ministry, would you want your wife to approach you about something like this or leave it be? If you would, what would be acceptable to say?
Why do I feel like the impaired one here? Maybe it's just my heart and mind that needs fixing...
Sorry for being so long-winded.
< Message edited by pianofirstlady -- 8/18/2008 5:38:51 AM >
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/18/2008 8:16:30 AM
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rcjames
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I would suggest to get over it or not to marry him.
You might read the 13th chapter of First Corinthians.
Thanks
RC
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/18/2008 8:33:59 AM
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mvic
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RCJames is 100% right.
You say: "I'm starting to feel like I need a professional here!"
I think you're right too. Seek professional help and take a copy of what you told us here with you.
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/18/2008 8:46:19 AM
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sisrev
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If you are embarrassed now, it will only get worse for you after you're married. There is a danger that you will suppress this in order to just get along, then someday in a fit of anger or pique mention it---and he will wonder why, if it has bothered you so much, you never mentioned it before. Then he may wonder what other things you have been keeping from him--I foresee a snowball, here.
If you love this man enough to consider marrying him, you need to be open about it. You don't have to hurt his feelings or flog a horse to death, but I don't think there is anything wrong with mentioning to him that, because of your mother insisting that your family speak properly, you notice differences in speech, and that you think it would help him advance in the future--not just in ministry, but in life, and has he ever thought about working on his pronunciation and speech patterns.
Just mention it in passing--if he blows up about it or brushes it off, and does not want to seek help, then you will have to decide for yourself whether this is something that you can live with or not. Let's put it this way--is this a deal breaker, or not? Not just, can you live with it, but do you want to?
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/18/2008 9:12:48 AM
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mrsrevbob
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Ask yourself while praying, Do I have some agenda?
Is this the right agenda/
Then, resolve this. Always remember marriage is a work in progress. If you love him, marry him, and devite yourself to serving God with him. If you don't, so yourselves a favor and move on.
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/18/2008 9:20:30 AM
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youthrev
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God can use anyone, right? I think we're all agreed on that. I think if this is a speech impediment, such as something that may not be able to be fixed because of neural malfunctioning or physical makeup, you need to just understand that this is how God made him and He will be glorified by using your fiance AS IS, to the confounding of the wise.
On the other side, if it is something that could be corrected through dedication and hard work, I think your fiance needs to acknowledge it and work toward that. And he can do that without losing his "blackness" (sorry, didn't know how else to say it). I look at pastors such as Eddie Long and others and you can tell by listening (without ever having seen them) what race they are and they are very articulate. I'm saying this not to be offensive at all, but I want you to be able to speak to him about your concerns while helping him to understand he won't have to lose any racial identity as a result, okay?
If he can work through this by speech correcting exercises, then I think he should consider it. I think he will find it will open new avenues of ministry for him as well as helping him gain some respect from others. Some will resent the fact that he is "trying to forget where he came from", but that won't necessarily be the case. He has been called to preach the Word of the Most High God to save the lost, and he needs to put hard work into that preaching and the preparation for preaching. That's why I say if it is uncorrectable (without surgery or medicine), let it be. But if it can be corrected through a little extra effort, that effort needs to be applied.
I may get some flack for this response, but I'm speaking from experience. When I was growing up, I could not say my r's. They all sounded like "aw". I was never evaluated for speech, so I was never sent, but I always wondered about it. As I was going through high school I finally got fed up about it because it was a point of teasing (as well as my being small and skinny and a couple of facial features that made me a point of laughter). I couldn't do anything about the rest of me, but this one thing I worked on diligently to straighten out. I practiced reading out loud and I enunciated my own name alone and whenever I publicly said it. It seemed awkward, and I still sometimes slip up, but I am now a youth pastor and God has used my effort to His glory.
You know yourself and your fiance better than any of us on here, so you know what the real motivation is behind your desire. Some on here will tell you to let it go. If it's a physical thing, I agree. If it is something he can correct then I would say he should. If your relationship hinges on his speech impediment, then you need to pray about your own response, not what to say to him. As for how to talk to him, talk to him from the basis of the long friendship you have already established, from a point of love and concern for his future and your future together. And be willing to help him if he wants to work on it.
Sorry it's not simpler. It's just not. This whole thing needs to be prayed over, specifically your own motivations.
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/18/2008 7:19:28 PM
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pianofirstlady
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Thanks guys, for all of your responses. I totally agree that I need to continue praying about the whole thing. And yes, I do plan to put it in on the table during our premarital counseling.
Youthrev, thank you so much for sharing your personal account. That was really touching...and an amazing testament to what God can do when we're willing to put forth the effort. I guess this is just hard for me because my fiance is such a calm, loving, generous and accepting man. Lord knows I have my own shortcomings but he's willing to accept and look past them all.
Which is all well and good on one hand, but I believe that true love pushes us past the point of pacifying one another just to keep the peace and avoid confrontation. In whatever areas I'm weak or failing, I want him to "call me" on it and push me to get better!
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/18/2008 7:58:41 PM
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gaylel1
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Piano First Lady,
There are many who has handicaps and had successful lives. Many of these people went on to marry. Heather Whitehouse, who was Miss America, is deaf. Joni Earickson Tata is paralized from the neck down, then she later married and has a successful ministry dealing with disablities. David Ring has Cebreral Palsy, but he speaks to millions and a minister like your financee. Jennifer Rothchild is blind and has children and is also married.
I don't think someone who have a speech problem or any disablity should not be a deal breaker.
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/18/2008 9:04:33 PM
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dianetavegia
Posts: 2034
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I agree with the pastors and I believe you should not proceed with the wedding until you can work this through.
God used Moses even with his speech problem.
That being said, are the sermons taped? Has he heard himself preach?
You might mention to 'honey' that he has such powerful and Spirit led sermons but when he talks fast it's hard to understand all that he has been led to share.
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/18/2008 10:24:07 PM
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Wonder_Woman
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I'm going to chime in here as a person who has had some speech issues since I was very young. My parents were advised to take me to a speech therapist when I was 6, but because insurance didn't cover it and my family didn't have any extra money for something so "frivolous", I never saw a therapist. I have suffered with speech issues my entire life and was made fun of horribly as a child. It was not fun and it was humiliating and it was so hurtful. I truly believe this was a major reason I was so painfully shy as a child - I figured if I didn't talk, nobody would make fun of me.
It took some patient, loving friends who overlooked my speech issues, suggesting that I just slow down when I talked, and pointed out certain sounds that I was mispronouncing, and that made such a huge and positive difference in my life.
Now, I still have a few speech issues, particularly when I get upset or am really tired (and I didn't mention that I also have a slight hearing problem so I don't have a very good grasp on how softly or loudly I'm talking), but I am very grateful for the advice of caring friends.
So, coming from my perspective, my suggestion would be to tape the sermons and have him listen. Give him a lot of encouragement. Use your "training" from your upbringing with your teacher mom to perhaps point out certain sounds that he might be having trouble with. Ask him if he thinks a speech therapist might be helpful for him rather than feeling as if you are picking on him. Sometimes it just takes a little encouragement and patience.
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/18/2008 10:39:09 PM
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FROGkissin
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I'm sorry if this is a repeated thought:
If in fact the two of you are partners in ministry --as you should be--you should be able to talk to him about anything and everything that is ministry related. You should be able to pray together, and ask each other for wisdom. My friends and I are able to talk about this kind of thing--an engaged couple certainly should be able to. If your relationship lacks the underlying trust and bond that makes constructive suggestions difficult, then you have some issues that need to be addressed.
Often times, this kind of problem can be resolved with a voice coach--there is an amazing variety of things a voice coach can help you fix. It's not the same as a speech therapist. Most speakers could benefit from a consultation with a coach now and then.
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/18/2008 11:39:21 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 2742
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God can use a man such as David Ring who suffers from CP
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_04Ey704MY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMuXrLvWEsI
It could be that he has something that can be corrected by a speach patholigist. Or, in the case of David Ring's something that is genetic.
The question is do you love him for who he is, speach issues and all?
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/19/2008 12:15:05 AM
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stimulus
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I think you need to discuss it with him. If nothing else, you need to know how the speech impediment, if that's what it really is, affects him. If he is unable to pronounce words the way he wants to, he must feel ashamed and embarrassed about it at times. You, as his future spouse, need to know if it is hurtful to him emotionally, and if so, offer to support and assist him however he wants.
If he is speaking the way he wants - "lazy" as you say - then it's not a speech impediment, it's just a dialect of English. It's not a privileged dialect, not the "right" one, but it's not a speech impediment. Certainly, the two of you need to discuss it, because if that is how he wants to speak and you don't want your children speaking that way, you are going to have some conflict over it!
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/19/2008 10:24:02 PM
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Sadey
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You need to find out if he is willing to change now, before you marry him.
Its not fair and really cruel for you to make him think you think hes just fine the way he is and then after marriage find out how you really feel.
My advice would be that if you can't love him just the way he is and trust God to make the changes God wants to make then he is better off without you. It won't go away after you marry him, it will just fester and grow.
We women tend to want to fix our men whether God thinks they need fixing or not.  We really believe that we know best. After being married for awhile you learn how wrong that idea is.
< Message edited by Sadey -- 8/19/2008 10:30:56 PM >
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/20/2008 1:17:17 PM
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GregandJenny
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From: Near Seattle Washington
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quote:
I do have to admit that when we visit more progressive churches with mostly articulate people or get around my family and friends - who I must say are by and large very well spoken people - I'm sometimes embarrassed.
This saddens me. God uses whom he choses where he choses. Look at some of the disciples. If you're embarrassed now you're probably always gonna be embaraased and this is not the man you need to be marrying. Do him a service and hit the road jack don't come back no more no more no more....
G
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/20/2008 1:26:56 PM
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bluestone
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You need to be very open and talk to him about it.
I am wondering how he got ordained to preach, and secured a church while having a speech impediment. Pastors need to have excellent communication skills. It would be like a music minister who sang off key.
If this church were to shut down, or decide to get a new pastor, what are his chances of getting on with another church?
seeing a good speech pathologist for an evaluation is te first step. Working hard to do whatever is possible to over come the problem as much as is the second step.
Don't feel bad about embarrassment at times. Just talk to him and work together to get help.
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/20/2008 1:33:33 PM
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GregandJenny
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quote:
I am wondering how he got ordained to preach, and secured a church while having a speech impediment
Are you serious? Moses had a speech impediment. Do people think that because we are in the 21st Century that God is limited on who He uses?
In in many organizations now all of the Pastors do not preach.
G
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It does not have to be well with my circumstance to be well with my soul!
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/20/2008 1:47:37 PM
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youthrev
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If he's called, he's called. Romans 11:29 states, "God's gifts and calling are irrevocable." His speech issues may be one of the things he needs to work on, and it may keep him from getting a ministry position he wants, but if he's obedient to Christ and the church God has for him is obedient in their search for a pastor, the Lord will bring them together for His own glory.
His ordination has nothing to do with his speech issues. An ordination is an affirmation of a call by God to ministry. I think it's great that his evidence of a call is visible enough that he has been ordained by a church; he may or may not change his speech patterns. God can use anything for His glory.
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/20/2008 1:52:52 PM
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bluestone
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An ordination means that an examing board of elders has examined your educational credentials, lifestyle, gifts and graces, and has found you not lacking in those areas.
Every Tom, Dick, and Harry claims to be "Called". This is what is wrong in so many churches today. People without proper training are in pulpits. How could this guy have gotten through college speech classes (the minimum basic) to go on and get a job preaching, if he can't speak correctly?
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/20/2008 2:02:27 PM
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buckifn
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quote:
If you're a man in the ministry, would you want your wife to approach you about something like this or leave it be? If you would, what would be acceptable to say?
There are several things to consider here: First of all you have to realize anything that bothers you now is magnified ten thousand times MORE after you are married. There is an old saying that "when you get the license the mask comes off" and that is more true than you can imagine. Time and familiarity make it so much easier to "just be who you truly are" minus the mask.
The question is do you love this man enough to accept him just as he is right now? If not, don't marry him.
Yes, I would want my wife to level with me about anything of any nature that bugs her and was giving her second thoughts about our relationship. Isn't it acting out a lie not to do that?
The Bible says what is in a person comes out...1 blow up too many and boom you are going to hit him right between the eyes with your true feelings anyhow. So why not show your love for him now by talking to him about it face to face with love and support? Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. So what is in your heart for him?
Finally, if a minister is allowing tv time to make his ministry suffer then by all means that should be addressed.
The Bible is very clear about this- "study to show thyself approved, a workman that needeth not be ashamed rightly dividing the Word of Truth.
We are called to lead yes, but we are also called to a deeper level of accountability to God as a leader.
It kills me sometimes to pass up attending my fav. team's football games when I already have season tickets, but if my leadership responsibility demands extra preparation time then so be it. God's Work comes before my entertainment.
So yes, you need to have a serious talk with your possible future husband and lay it all on the table.
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/20/2008 2:03:50 PM
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GregandJenny
Posts: 616
Joined: 2/16/2006
From: Near Seattle Washington
Status: offline
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quote:
How could this guy have gotten through college speech classes (the minimum basic) to go on and get a job preaching, if he can't speak correctly?
Not all churches ordain like this.
G
_____________________________
It does not have to be well with my circumstance to be well with my soul!
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/20/2008 2:23:16 PM
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KuKu
Posts: 899
Joined: 5/20/2005
From: Somewhere out there
Status: offline
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I see no example of anything definable as a speech impediment. He sounds like he simply speaks as those around him, and as those around him did as he was growing up. And you are not comfortable with that- you want him to be more refined, and less 'culturally obvious'... which are things that no speech therapy will give him. He may learn to end his words with a solid r (which means he can never preach in boston LOL), but it will not change his culture or his way of being.
The statement "I'd like to think..." say a lot. If you yourself is wondering, and you admit that it may make him self-conscious, do him the favor of deciding if you can TRULY love him the way he is before bringing it up... that may just solve your problem much more quickly than any 'lessons' ever could-
I say this from some semblance of understanding- I was engaged to a gentleman with a completely paralyzed leg from childhood polio. I had to decide if I could deal with that, and the stares, and the 'instant opinions' formed upon seeing him... People always compliment his sermons, his insights, and his musical talents, but hiding that leg was never an option-
In the end, could deal with his limp, but his mother couldn't deal with me LOL
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/20/2008 3:21:38 PM
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MindySue69
Posts: 321
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline
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DL Moody was criticized for having poor grammar and speaking skills.
quote:
Another critic, who commended his zeal in filling the pews he had hired in Plymouth Church, suggested that he should realize the limitations of his vocation and not attempt to speak in public.
" ' You make too many mistakes in grammar,' he complained.
" ' I know I make mistakes,' was the reply, 'and I lack a great many things, but I'm doing the best I can with what I've got.'
He paused and looked at the man searchingly, adding with his own irresistible manner:
" ' Look here, friend, you've got grammar enough--what are you doing with it for the Master?' "
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RE: Pastor/Fiance's Speech Impediment - Ignore It or He... - 8/20/2008 8:31:22 PM
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hjemerson
Posts: 232
Joined: 3/4/2008
Status: offline
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I found if you are honset with him Pray and let the Lord work thur this with you and the family,
As to Bluestone I would found it hard to have a prefec | | |
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