quote:

ORIGINAL: zamdad

quote:


......While there is/has been disappointment in brothers and sisters who don't walk their talk, there is another aspect to this disappointment as well. I've seen far too many pastors, lay leaders and well intended Christians duped by the con artists posing as believers. All too often I've seen church leaders come to the defense of a poser completely ignoring the warnings placed before them. They usually retort that they are working on the offenders relationship with Christ and that the offender is no longer the person he/she once was. And, all too frequently, they will deny their gut when things seem amiss within the congregation. It all too frequently seems that people don't want to know what's under the mask of those they are ministering too. How can one have a renewing of the mind if no one is willing to explore where the mind has been and how it has previously functioned?

Jesus teaches us that, "By their fruit shall you know them." In God's wisdom, He is allowing the wheat to grow alongside the tares but one day He will separate them both. Not everyone who says, "Lord, Lord shall enter the kingdom of Heaven." It is a cold hard fact that deceivers are amongst the children of God and pretend to go under God's banner. We may become upset about it but it will do no good. We have to be patient and let God do His work in His perfect timing.

I cringe when I watch certain 'Christian' Channels on TV. There are some preachers who don't seem to have any message other than that of their god - 'money' for instance. I can let these people depress me and pull me down by what I could allow myself to think about them but in the end, I realise that this will do no good other than possibly pull me down spiritually. However, in saying this, how should we respond to such?

Should we:

Be passive towards such? No - that would be a sin because we are turning our backs on something which is wrong.
Be plagued about such? No - this too is wrong and could develop into sinfulness in our own hearts.

I could be wrong, but perhaps if we choose instead to:
Be prayerful about such and ask God for patience to see His Word come to pass. This will make a difference in our hearts and perhaps even the other person's heart eventually also.

Does anyone have any other thoughts which could help in this area?

< Message edited by Little_1 -- 8/21/2008 5:59:38 AM >

_____________________________

In Step with the Lord
(Updated every Friday)

quote:

ORIGINAL: deb77

I'm coming in to an established thread, but would like to comment on the OP question. How do we renew our minds?

I have been a Christian for 45 years now, and just during the past couple of years have I truly learned the answer to this question. I couldn't learn it because I didn't see myself clearly. Once I saw my spirit as it truly was, I could begin to practice renewing my mind.

As a woman, I have had a bent to a "victim's" mindset for a number of good reasons. Now, I see that all of my feelings, hurts, and thoughts were actually crossroads for me to make a choice: think what is true, or think whatever made sense to me at the moment. Though a Christian, I had been living most of my life by my own sense of things. I began to see my thoughts about events, people, values, etc as lies that I had bought into.

That was a step that propelled me into searching for truth like never before. I wanted to know "truth" about everything! What a new and deep level of spiritual growth I had entered into.

I couldn't just keep responding to life as I always had. I questioned the response that arose inside of me. I checked, before I responded to a situation, to see if there was an underlying lie that caused me to feel or react the way I was about to. It wasn't enough, though, to see my reaction as wrong. I needed to replace the old lie with new, lasting "truth" for knowing the truth will set one free.

I still endeavor to find out truth before I react. I have reverted to the old "self" a few times each week, but I pray that God continues to strengthen me to keep building truth in my mind so I can replace those old lies, bad thoughts, and attitudes.

Hey, that's what the Bible is for! Learning truth, meditating on it, and then believing it instead of myself!! What a blessing it is in practical everyday life!

This is what walking in the spirit is, as opposed to walking in the flesh. It's so good to finally understand what that means! Now I am free to make choices to no longer take offense, even when it is intended. No problem. I now have strength to endure unjust treatment. No problem. It's all for God's glory, so now onward to learn joy during various trials... (still growing up in Christ)

quote:

As a woman, I have had a bent to a "victim's" mindset for a number of good reasons. Now, I see that all of my feelings, hurts, and thoughts were actually crossroads for me to make a choice: think what is true, or think whatever made sense to me at the moment. Though a Christian, I had been living most of my life by my own sense of things. I began to see my thoughts about events, people, values, etc as lies that I had bought into.

quote:

quote:

Sometimes, I get rubbed up the wrong way by certain responses on site and I end up judging my brethren. I likewise believe that I too rub others up the wrong way. Sometimes these situations can occur due to our differing cultures; sometimes because 'confidence in the Lord' is mistaken for arrogance; and sometimes it will be spiritual immaturity on my part or the part of others.

I think this brings up another good point with regard to worldview. How much of our worldview is formed by our culture? Not just the media, but the communities we live in? For instance, most of us posting on this site are probably from middle class communities. How we think and act is affected by and a product of where we live. We tend to miniister to the poor from our own middle class values, completly disregarding the values of the other culture. We tend to think that everyone from the culture of poverty wants what we have. Yet, we're asking them to come in and assimilate into a culture that is completey foriegn to them. Sometimes it seems that we lack the ability to see things from outside the perspective of self. We can only relate to things from our own life experience. Sometimes, however, we have to step outside of our comfort zones to gain some experience from a different perspective.

quote:

I'm coming in to an established thread, but would like to comment on the OP question. How do we renew our minds?

I have been a Christian for 45 years now, and just during the past couple of years have I truly learned the answer to this question. I couldn't learn it because I didn't see myself clearly. Once I saw my spirit as it truly was, I could begin to practice renewing my mind.

As a woman, I have had a bent to a "victim's" mindset for a number of good reasons. Now, I see that all of my feelings, hurts, and thoughts were actually crossroads for me to make a choice: think what is true, or think whatever made sense to me at the moment. Though a Christian, I had been living most of my life by my own sense of things. I began to see my thoughts about events, people, values, etc as lies that I had bought into.

That was a step that propelled me into searching for truth like never before. I wanted to know "truth" about everything! What a new and deep level of spiritual growth I had entered into.

I couldn't just keep responding to life as I always had. I questioned the response that arose inside of me. I checked, before I responded to a situation, to see if there was an underlying lie that caused me to feel or react the way I was about to. It wasn't enough, though, to see my reaction as wrong. I needed to replace the old lie with new, lasting "truth" for knowing the truth will set one free.

I still endeavor to find out truth before I react. I have reverted to the old "self" a few times each week, but I pray that God continues to strengthen me to keep building truth in my mind so I can replace those old lies, bad thoughts, and attitudes.

Hey, that's what the Bible is for! Learning truth, meditating on it, and then believing it instead of myself!! What a blessing it is in practical everyday life!

This is what walking in the spirit is, as opposed to walking in the flesh. It's so good to finally understand what that means! Now I am free to make choices to no longer take offense, even when it is intended. No problem. I now have strength to endure unjust treatment. No problem. It's all for God's glory, so now onward to learn joy during various trials... (still growing up in Christ)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Little_1

The question is - how do we renew our minds?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Little_1

quote:

The Apostle Paul

Romans 6:23-25
"But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? I thank God—through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin."

When Paul says, "O wretched man that I am!" he does not imply a false humility that some men possess nor does he suggest that God looks on him as a useless and horrible person despite his feelings of wretchedness! What this passage does seem to suggest is that Paul is aware of his fallen nature and the war that goes on between his flesh and the spirit within.

Paul also points out an important factor in serving God and this factor has to do with his mind (as highlighted above). Elsewhere in the Bible we are told to "renew our minds". I believe Paul was able to serve God faithfully because he had his mind spiritually renewed; I also believe the same necessity of mind renewal is necessary to all God's people today.

The question is - how do we renew our minds?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Liveloved

quote:

I'm coming in to an established thread, but would like to comment on the OP question. How do we renew our minds?

I have been a Christian for 45 years now, and just during the past couple of years have I truly learned the answer to this question. I couldn't learn it because I didn't see myself clearly. Once I saw my spirit as it truly was, I could begin to practice renewing my mind.

As a woman, I have had a bent to a "victim's" mindset for a number of good reasons. Now, I see that all of my feelings, hurts, and thoughts were actually crossroads for me to make a choice: think what is true, or think whatever made sense to me at the moment. Though a Christian, I had been living most of my life by my own sense of things. I began to see my thoughts about events, people, values, etc as lies that I had bought into.

That was a step that propelled me into searching for truth like never before. I wanted to know "truth" about everything! What a new and deep level of spiritual growth I had entered into.

I couldn't just keep responding to life as I always had. I questioned the response that arose inside of me. I checked, before I responded to a situation, to see if there was an underlying lie that caused me to feel or react the way I was about to. It wasn't enough, though, to see my reaction as wrong. I needed to replace the old lie with new, lasting "truth" for knowing the truth will set one free.

I still endeavor to find out truth before I react. I have reverted to the old "self" a few times each week, but I pray that God continues to strengthen me to keep building truth in my mind so I can replace those old lies, bad thoughts, and attitudes.

Hey, that's what the Bible is for! Learning truth, meditating on it, and then believing it instead of myself!! What a blessing it is in practical everyday life!

This is what walking in the spirit is, as opposed to walking in the flesh. It's so good to finally understand what that means! Now I am free to make choices to no longer take offense, even when it is intended. No problem. I now have strength to endure unjust treatment. No problem. It's all for God's glory, so now onward to learn joy during various trials... (still growing up in Christ)

Amen, Deb! Your testimony has clearly demonstrated what it takes to renew the mind and walk by the Spirit. Thank you. It is a continual dying to ourselves, our thoughts, our own inclinations and self love. It is seeing our fleshly selves for what we are---not excusing, not denying, not blaming or rationalizing. It is absolute TRUTHFULNESS which is what the gospel message is ALL about.

He desires truth in our innermost being. Not lies. Not deception. Not the proud, excusing self. No, He desires our truthfulness about ourselves. The fleshly self hates truth, hates the light because it exposes the evil. So the flesh desires darkness.

But if we walk in the light, practice the truth by coming to the light. we see and turn from our ways and we see Him in all His beauty and glory and we desire Him most of all. And then, you are right, we are FREE and what others do and say no longer hurts us or is reason for self defense. We KNOW ourselves and nothing good is in us. And we KNOW Jesus. And He has set us FREE!

Amen. Thank you dear sister for sharing truthfully from your heart. I pray your testimony blesses many. LL

quote:

ORIGINAL: deb77

quote:

ORIGINAL: Liveloved

quote:

I'm coming in to an established thread, but would like to comment on the OP question. How do we renew our minds?

I have been a Christian for 45 years now, and just during the past couple of years have I truly learned the answer to this question. I couldn't learn it because I didn't see myself clearly. Once I saw my spirit as it truly was, I could begin to practice renewing my mind.

As a woman, I have had a bent to a "victim's" mindset for a number of good reasons. Now, I see that all of my feelings, hurts, and thoughts were actually crossroads for me to make a choice: think what is true, or think whatever made sense to me at the moment. Though a Christian, I had been living most of my life by my own sense of things. I began to see my thoughts about events, people, values, etc as lies that I had bought into.

That was a step that propelled me into searching for truth like never before. I wanted to know "truth" about everything! What a new and deep level of spiritual growth I had entered into.

I couldn't just keep responding to life as I always had. I questioned the response that arose inside of me. I checked, before I responded to a situation, to see if there was an underlying lie that caused me to feel or react the way I was about to. It wasn't enough, though, to see my reaction as wrong. I needed to replace the old lie with new, lasting "truth" for knowing the truth will set one free.

I still endeavor to find out truth before I react. I have reverted to the old "self" a few times each week, but I pray that God continues to strengthen me to keep building truth in my mind so I can replace those old lies, bad thoughts, and attitudes.

Hey, that's what the Bible is for! Learning truth, meditating on it, and then believing it instead of myself!! What a blessing it is in practical everyday life!

This is what walking in the spirit is, as opposed to walking in the flesh. It's so good to finally understand what that means! Now I am free to make choices to no longer take offense, even when it is intended. No problem. I now have strength to endure unjust treatment. No problem. It's all for God's glory, so now onward to learn joy during various trials... (still growing up in Christ)

Amen, Deb! Your testimony has clearly demonstrated what it takes to renew the mind and walk by the Spirit. Thank you. It is a continual dying to ourselves, our thoughts, our own inclinations and self love. It is seeing our fleshly selves for what we are---not excusing, not denying, not blaming or rationalizing. It is absolute TRUTHFULNESS which is what the gospel message is ALL about.

He desires truth in our innermost being. Not lies. Not deception. Not the proud, excusing self. No, He desires our truthfulness about ourselves. The fleshly self hates truth, hates the light because it exposes the evil. So the flesh desires darkness.

But if we walk in the light, practice the truth by coming to the light. we see and turn from our ways and we see Him in all His beauty and glory and we desire Him most of all. And then, you are right, we are FREE and what others do and say no longer hurts us or is reason for self defense. We KNOW ourselves and nothing good is in us. And we KNOW Jesus. And He has set us FREE!

Amen. Thank you dear sister for sharing truthfully from your heart. I pray your testimony blesses many. LL

Thank you for your encouragement and I, too, hope that the Lord Jesus Christ uses these words to bless others.

To simplify, I will state that I have learned to renew my mind by thinking on truth and then acting on that truth by seeing my thinking as a lie, and then replacing it with a truth from God's word.

i.e. "Nobody loves me." I truly used to believe this because of my parents' divorce, the sexual abuse of my stepfather, the rejection by my first husband and his later infidelity, and even my new husband when he is busy. Now when my feelings start to tell me that no one loves me (demonic stronghold in my head), I can dissipate it with one thought: Jesus loved me so much, He died for me. John 3:16 tells me this is so.

"Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever thing are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthy--meditate on these things." Philippians 4:8

quote:

ORIGINAL: URForgiven

quote:

ORIGINAL: deb77

quote:

ORIGINAL: Liveloved

quote:

I'm coming in to an established thread, but would like to comment on the OP question. How do we renew our minds?

I have been a Christian for 45 years now, and just during the past couple of years have I truly learned the answer to this question. I couldn't learn it because I didn't see myself clearly. Once I saw my spirit as it truly was, I could begin to practice renewing my mind.

As a woman, I have had a bent to a "victim's" mindset for a number of good reasons. Now, I see that all of my feelings, hurts, and thoughts were actually crossroads for me to make a choice: think what is true, or think whatever made sense to me at the moment. Though a Christian, I had been living most of my life by my own sense of things. I began to see my thoughts about events, people, values, etc as lies that I had bought into.

That was a step that propelled me into searching for truth like never before. I wanted to know "truth" about everything! What a new and deep level of spiritual growth I had entered into.

I couldn't just keep responding to life as I always had. I questioned the response that arose inside of me. I checked, before I responded to a situation, to see if there was an underlying lie that caused me to feel or react the way I was about to. It wasn't enough, though, to see my reaction as wrong. I needed to replace the old lie with new, lasting "truth" for knowing the truth will set one free.

I still endeavor to find out truth before I react. I have reverted to the old "self" a few times each week, but I pray that God continues to strengthen me to keep building truth in my mind so I can replace those old lies, bad thoughts, and attitudes.

Hey, that's what the Bible is for! Learning truth, meditating on it, and then believing it instead of myself!! What a blessing it is in practical everyday life!

This is what walking in the spirit is, as opposed to walking in the flesh. It's so good to finally understand what that means! Now I am free to make choices to no longer take offense, even when it is intended. No problem. I now have strength to endure unjust treatment. No problem. It's all for God's glory, so now onward to learn joy during various trials... (still growing up in Christ)

Amen, Deb! Your testimony has clearly demonstrated what it takes to renew the mind and walk by the Spirit. Thank you. It is a continual dying to ourselves, our thoughts, our own inclinations and self love. It is seeing our fleshly selves for what we are---not excusing, not denying, not blaming or rationalizing. It is absolute TRUTHFULNESS which is what the gospel message is ALL about.

He desires truth in our innermost being. Not lies. Not deception. Not the proud, excusing self. No, He desires our truthfulness about ourselves. The fleshly self hates truth, hates the light because it exposes the evil. So the flesh desires darkness.

But if we walk in the light, practice the truth by coming to the light. we see and turn from our ways and we see Him in all His beauty and glory and we desire Him most of all. And then, you are right, we are FREE and what others do and say no longer hurts us or is reason for self defense. We KNOW ourselves and nothing good is in us. And we KNOW Jesus. And He has set us FREE!

Amen. Thank you dear sister for sharing truthfully from your heart. I pray your testimony blesses many. LL

Thank you for your encouragement and I, too, hope that the Lord Jesus Christ uses these words to bless others.

To simplify, I will state that I have learned to renew my mind by thinking on truth and then acting on that truth by seeing my thinking as a lie, and then replacing it with a truth from God's word.

i.e. "Nobody loves me." I truly used to believe this because of my parents' divorce, the sexual abuse of my stepfather, the rejection by my first husband and his later infidelity, and even my new husband when he is busy. Now when my feelings start to tell me that no one loves me (demonic stronghold in my head), I can dissipate it with one thought: Jesus loved me so much, He died for me. John 3:16 tells me this is so.

"Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever thing are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthy--meditate on these things." Philippians 4:8

There is a battle being waged; the nature of this spiritual war is truth versus error and the battleground is the minds of men.

If we are not willing to give up the lie that the truth exposes, then we are effectively cutting ourselves off from the power that is available to us through the indwelling life of Christ...and we cease to grow in Him. We become a branch that is withered and lifeless, instead of vibrant and alive.

As Jesus said, "If you hold to my teaching, you are really My disciples. Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free."

You speak of the God I know and Love, Deb. Thank You. And yes, you have indeed richly blessed me.

Peace

quote:

ORIGINAL: URForgiven

quote:

ORIGINAL: Little_1

The question is - how do we renew our minds?

We do not renew our minds, Christ renews our mind as we offer ourselves to Him. It is turning away from what we were before we were saved [in the world] and turning to Jesus. As we depend upon Him the Holy Spirit leads us into truth, and truth is what transforms our mind from the error of our old way of thinking.

Romans 12:1-2
"Therefore, I urge you, brothers, in view of God's mercy, to offer your bodies as living sacrifices, holy and pleasing to God—this is your spiritual act of worship. Do not conform any longer to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God's will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will"

Peace

quote:

There is a battle being waged; the nature of this spiritual war is truth versus error and the battleground is the minds of men.

quote:

ORIGINAL: OneJohn410

......For me, this renewing of my mind is a 'new-life-long' process that is going to be perfected at the end of this life.

quote:

ORIGINAL: OneJohn410

"I do not like 'how do we'-type posts" ......."Give me a what is important in the renewing of one's mind?" post any day.

quote:

ORIGINAL: stampinlady

quote:

There is a battle being waged; the nature of this spiritual war is truth versus error and the battleground is the minds of men.

This is so true. Deb, I loved your post. I too am learning to look at life differently that I had before and it hard at times. I want to teach my teens this because I don't want them to struggle like I did. I want them to know how to "renew their minds" so that they don't choose some paths that I did in my late teens. Any good books for them?

quote:

ORIGINAL: stampinlady

quote:

There is a battle being waged; the nature of this spiritual war is truth versus error and the battleground is the minds of men.

This is so true. Deb, I loved your post. I too am learning to look at life differently that I had before and it hard at times. I want to teach my teens this because I don't want them to struggle like I did. I want them to know how to "renew their minds" so that they don't choose some paths that I did in my late teens. Any good books for them?

quote:

ORIGINAL: slimon11

What a wonderful thread, thank you all. Reading this has blessed me and answered some questions floating around in my head.