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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 2:41:33 PM
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OneOfHisJewels
Posts: 2549
Joined: 8/9/2007
From: California
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quote:
RC, on my next plane trip, I want our seats to be next to yours!
Aw, Maggie, what about me? I be entertainin' de kids, too. Can I at least be 2nd choice?
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"We basically use what I have seen referred to as "get off your butt" parenting. It employs more interaction, more redirection, more prevention, and usually less spanking."
-Mrs. Wifey
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 2:45:41 PM
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OneOfHisJewels
Posts: 2549
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From: California
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quote:
It sounds to me like the whole breastfeeding argument is (although unintentionally), making a good argument FOR separate children/family sections. That way, moms could breastfeed in peace, and those traveling without children wouldn't have to be exposed to seeing any breasts, especially if the set up was made that the other people didn't have to walk past the children's area to use the restroom, either by having two restrooms or having the children's area in front.
And, as long as I'm dreaming, let's make the whole family section have..
1.Seats in a circle, instead of a row.
2.Kids movies, toys.
3.some sleeping space
4.bottle warmer
5. a person to entertain the older kids whose infant siblings are being fed or watched
_____________________________
"We basically use what I have seen referred to as "get off your butt" parenting. It employs more interaction, more redirection, more prevention, and usually less spanking."
-Mrs. Wifey
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 3:14:19 PM
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OneOfHisJewels
Posts: 2549
Joined: 8/9/2007
From: California
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quote:
Or the large wide businessman who sits there next to you with his hands in his pockets "getting himself comfortable".
(yes I am speaking from personal experience, lol)
ewww!
_____________________________
"We basically use what I have seen referred to as "get off your butt" parenting. It employs more interaction, more redirection, more prevention, and usually less spanking."
-Mrs. Wifey
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 3:24:37 PM
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Sideways
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My husband had some suggestions for the men who don't want a woman breastfeeding on a plane:
1.) If you're the poster who'd rather hear a baby scream then have the women next you breastfeed, please take a plane-wide vote first. Someone would surely switch places with you.
2.) If you're next to the window, look out the window. If you're not, start a conversation with the person on the other side of you.
3.) Improve your mind by reading something.
4.) Even if she does "whip it out faster then you can look away" (highly improbable, from personal experience), what in the world are you doing staring an another man's wife that way? Even if her chest is completely clothed you shouldn't be staring it.
_____________________________
This warranty does not include shark bites, bear attacks and children under five.
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 4:04:25 PM
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lw9
Posts: 1136
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quote:
sideways:
1.) If you're the poster who'd rather hear a baby scream then have the women next you breastfeed, please take a plane-wide vote first. Someone would surely switch places with you.
2.) If you're next to the window, look out the window. If you're not, start a conversation with the person on the other side of you.
3.) Improve your mind by reading something.
4.) Even if she does "whip it out faster then you can look away" (highly improbable, from personal experience), what in the world are you doing staring an another man's wife that way? Even if her chest is completely clothed you shouldn't be staring it.
Or... rather than expecting everyone else to accomodate, the breast feeding woman could just cover up.  As Christians called to modesty, there is no excuse for exposing one's breasts in public when there are other alternatives.
As to number 4, you're being ridiculous. No one has to be staring directly at a woman's chest to see them exposing their breasts.
Reality check: A woman opening her blouse and exposing a breast in public is naturally going to draw eyes to that region no matter what. There are men who don't really give a toss if a woman is breast feeding. A naked breast is still a naked breast to them, and she's giving them a reason to stare.
_____________________________
Aperture Science. We do what we must because we can.
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 4:15:43 PM
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zoebob
Posts: 8778
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: land of limbo
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quote:
Or... rather than expecting everyone else to accomodate, the breast feeding woman could just cover up. As Christians called to modesty, there is no excuse for exposing one's breasts in public when there are other alternatives.
not one woman here has supported exposing themselves deliberately while breastfeeding. All say they do their best to keep covered up but accidents do happen.
Often there are no other alternatives. Many babies won't take a bottle. Many mothers can't pump. Other's, like Jen said will be able to enter a wet t-shirt contest if they don't nurse on time.
quote:
Reality check: A woman opening her blouse and exposing a breast in public is naturally going to draw eyes to that region no matter what. There are men who don't really give a toss if a woman is breast feeding. A naked breast is still a naked breast to them, and she's giving them a reason to stare.
A woman nursing her baby isn't going to be opening up a typical blouse with buttons up the front to nurse. They will most likely use a nursing top that has discreet slits that can be opened for nursing without needing to expose. Or perhaps a loose t-shirt that the baby can hide under.
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L-R: Ellies DD1, Ellies DD2, DS, Ellies DS3
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 4:22:35 PM
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OneOfHisJewels
Posts: 2549
Joined: 8/9/2007
From: California
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quote:
Or... rather than expecting everyone else to accomodate, the breast feeding woman could just cover up. As Christians called to modesty, there is no excuse for exposing one's breasts in public when there are other alternatives.
As to number 4, you're being ridiculous. No one has to be staring directly at a woman's chest to see them exposing their breasts.
Reality check: A woman opening her blouse and exposing a breast in public is naturally going to draw eyes to that region no matter what. There are men who don't really give a toss if a woman is breast feeding. A naked breast is still a naked breast to them, and she's giving them a reason to stare.
Why do you think seeing a woman breastfeeding is so bad? I think it is a beautiful sight. In fact, when I see a woman breastfeeding, I am not disgusted, if anything, it reminds that it is almost the #1 thing about being a mom that I'm really sad I missed out on(I'm single with no kids). There are many things I haven't gotten to do with kids, in spite of not being a mom, but breastfeeding obviously ain't one of 'em.
< Message edited by OneOfHisJewels -- 8/17/2008 5:51:14 PM >
_____________________________
"We basically use what I have seen referred to as "get off your butt" parenting. It employs more interaction, more redirection, more prevention, and usually less spanking."
-Mrs. Wifey
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 4:24:31 PM
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Neeva_Candida
Posts: 119
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Wow! With all the posts about Special "Children's" Sections on planes not one person has suggested the wing.
~Neeva
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 5:12:26 PM
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Sideways
Posts: 3627
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quote:
ORIGINAL: zoebob
not one woman here has supported exposing themselves deliberately while breastfeeding. All say they do their best to keep covered up but accidents do happen.
Often there are no other alternatives. Many babies won't take a bottle. Many mothers can't pump. Other's, like Jen said will be able to enter a wet t-shirt contest if they don't nurse on time.
Or the baby is one of those who do not tolerate a blanket over his head.
Although it is a little amusing how vehemently these men are insisting on their rights to stare at a nursing mother, that she must cover up with a blanket even if it is warm in the plane or her baby really doesn't like it.
_____________________________
This warranty does not include shark bites, bear attacks and children under five.
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 5:12:31 PM
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garsyt
Posts: 2232
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With airline restrictions being what they are, even if a baby would take a bottle of breastmilk and a mom could pump, it is highly likely that the idiots at security check points wouldn't ALLOW a mother to bring more then a few ounces of breast milk if any at all. And a decent electric pump would take up nearly half of a decent sized carry on, and with the limitations on carry-ons and all the other stuff parents are "expected" to provide for their children - well it just isn't practical. Then there is the problem of storage. Then there is the issue of what to do with your children when you are pumping in the bathroom because it is often more difficult to get a pump to work properly thus you are exposing more then you would be if mom just simply nursed the child.
I too had a child that refused to take a bottle. She went straight from the breast to a cup at about 10 months.
Maybe special children's flights are in order with the option of allowing other travelers to buy tickets on this flights with the full understanding that they might have to deal with crying and a slight possibility of a flash of skin as a mom gets a baby latched to her breast.
Maybe these flights could employ flight attendants trained specifically to deal with the needs of families. Maybe this flights could have child friendly seating and car seats instead of big adult sized everything. Oh and lets not forget the entertainment! Always age appropriate and decided amongst the parents on board as a group!
And all of this and we don't want the prices raised either. Their high enough already. Pass the price of the extras on these flights to someone else on a child free flight. After all they are the ones that want this for the most part. Want the luxury of no possibility of children around to possibly bother you, then one must pay for it. After all we parents are the ones wanting the separate sections or flights - we are just asking for a bit of understanding of our points of view as well.
Still very glad we haven't had to fly anywhere in the past 13 years!
Blessings,
Garsy
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My Blog: www.moredayslikethisplease.wordpress.com
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 5:35:36 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
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From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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quote:
With airline restrictions being what they are, even if a baby would take a bottle of breastmilk and a mom could pump, it is highly likely that the idiots at security check points wouldn't ALLOW a mother to bring more then a few ounces of breast milk if any at all.
Actually, they have to allow breastmilk or formula. As long as the liquids are in a bottle or sippy cup I have never had anyone question me bringing liquids through security. Actually, TSA regulations even allow me to wear DD in a baby carrier when I walk through the metal detector, which is a new change in the past 6 months.
Still very glad that we have had all positive flying experiences and that we have the option to fly.
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 10:42:22 PM
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lw9
Posts: 1136
Joined: 7/22/2005
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quote:
zoebob: not one woman here has supported exposing themselves deliberately while breastfeeding. All say they do their best to keep covered up but accidents do happen.
Really? Cause these are the types of arguments I'm seeing here:
quote:
Going topless for the sake of attracting men is completely difference then temporarily exposing yourself to feed your child.
quote:
If my wonderful dh (who does view me in a sexual way, as he should) can separate the two different functions that my breasts were made to perform, why can't a stranger do the same? Or better yet...just look away...and leave us to feed our children in the way we were made to do it...
quote:
Again, if someone has a problem with a woman feeding her child in the way that God intended and provided for then he/she should go to Him about it. It's not offensive to feed a child...
quote:
The only time that isn't true is during latch on, and seriously, you can't look across the aisle for 30 seconds. That's why I think it's your sexual issues that need to be dealt with, not the nursing mom.
quote:
Although it is a little amusing how vehemently these men are insisting on their rights to stare at a nursing mother, that she must cover up with a blanket even if it is warm in the plane or her baby really doesn't like it.
_____________________________
Aperture Science. We do what we must because we can.
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 11:07:46 PM
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solo_soprano22
Posts: 2473
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From: I'm a Southern girl
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Lw9, I think some are just upset that America (as a whole) sees breasts as sexual, EVEN when it's for the purpose of feeding. If a breast is out, it can be seen as sexual...feeding someone or not feeding someone. In my experience, the breastfeeding mothers want the breastfeeding part to not be sexual...but this is America, and IMO, stuff like that isn't happening anytime soon. I do not see it as fair to expect people to see breasts as sexual, but then automatically condition them to create a disconnect if one is out for a baby (or feeding purposes). That's not a "sexual issue" to me...not the fact that there are breasts out in order to breastfeed. If a breast is seen as sexual, purpose doesn't matter. If you want a solution, then find a way to de-sexualize breasts when the breasts are being used for feeding (or altogether).
I really don't care myself if something's exposed. I'm used to it because of the field I'm in...but I know there isn't an America who sees things the way I do. Culture in this country (or conditioning) doesn't agree with most of the breastfeeding moms I see here.
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For God, For Learning, Forever.
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/17/2008 11:59:49 PM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6385
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LOL, Marcus.
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Ziva: It is possible. I do not remember all their names.
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/18/2008 12:01:43 AM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3547
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Brestfed on the plane once, with my six month old, and I had three year old daughter at the time with me also. I was sitting by a man, a dad himself, he helped me with my dignity, he turned his head, and helped me cover up. The other passengers on the plane offered to hold my baby, while I ate, with three year old.
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/18/2008 12:18:23 AM
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buckifn
Posts: 1760
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quote:
Come on. I don't want to see your breast or any other woman's breast, period.
Ok, so who is making you look? I think it is very beautiful to see a woman breastfeeding her child and also very natural.
Maybe you should just close your eyes and pray for the two of them?
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RE: Special "Children's" Section on Planes... - 8/18/2008 12:26:00 AM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3547
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Well not wanting to show my jugs to you either to be honest, but, you could turn your head, if in a situation, a mom had to feed her baby, and act with respect.
quote:
ORIGINAL: buckifn
quote:
Come on. I don't want to see your breast or any other woman's breast, period.
Ok, so who is making you look? I think it is very beautiful to see a woman breastfeeding her child and also very natural.
Maybe you should just close your eyes and pray for the two of them?
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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See how they complain when they can't get coffee. 
Now they are called 'breeders' and scoffed at and complained about.