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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/6/2008 1:55:22 PM
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HenriettasCat
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Agapetos, you can take up to one year maternity leave, for 9 months of that you can get statutory maternity pay which was about £100 per week when I took it a couple of years ago. On top of that my employer continued to pay 90% of my earnings for the first 6 weeks and 50% up until 6 months. I also continued to recieve other work benefits such as essential car user allowance. With the stat benefit in place I actually earned more whilst I was on maternity leave!
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/6/2008 3:25:15 PM
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clag4christ
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Mrs.X
Wow, that seems high to me, I guess cause I'm not used to that. I wonder if sales tax was that high here if we could have socialized healthcare too. Does a lot of other funding have to go into that, or does the sales tax seem to cover it? Like does a lot come out of your paychecks too for tax?
I believe their taxes are so high so that the government can 'afford' to give the medical care as well as other things for 'free' to it's citizens. Socialized medical isn't free...
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If you don't want people to insult your intelligence; don't make it so obvious that you have none.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/6/2008 3:56:04 PM
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Mrs.X
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Well, that would make sense.
My dad sent me this interesting tidbit on British WW2 History that was just de-classified last year. Very cool!
LINK
quote:
Starting in 1941, an increasing number of British airmen found themselves as the involuntary guests of the Third Reich, and the crown was casting-about for ways and means to facilitate their escape. Now obviously, one of the most helpful aids to that end is a useful and accurate map, one showing not only where-stuff-was, but also showing the locations of "safe houses", where a POW on-the-lam could go for food and shelter. Paper maps had some real drawbacks: They make a lot of noise when you open and fold them, they wear-out rapidly, And if they get wet, they turn into mush.
Someone in MI-5 (similar to America's CIA) got the idea of printing escape maps on silk. It's durable, can be
scrunched-up into tiny wads, and unfolded as many times as needed, and makes no noise what-so-ever. At that time, there was only one manufacturer in Great Britain that had perfected the technology of printing on silk, and that was John Waddington, Ltd.
When approached by the government, the firm was only too happy to do its bit for the war effort.
By pure coincidence, Waddington was also the U.K. Licensee for the popular American board game, Monopoly. As it happened, "games and pastimes" was a category of item qualified for insertion into "CARE packages", dispatched by the International Red Cross, to prisoners of war.
Under the strictest of secrecy, in a securely guarded and inaccessible old workshop on the grounds of Waddington's, a group of sworn-to-secrecy employees began mass-producing escape maps, keyed to each region of Germany or Italy where Allied POW camps were located (Red Cross packages were delivered to prisoners in accordance with that same regional system). When processed, these maps could be folded into such tiny dots that they would actually fit inside a Monopoly playing piece.
As long as they were at it, the clever workmen at Waddington's also managed to add:
1. A playing token, containing a small magnetic compass,
2. A two-part metal file that could easily be screwed together.
3. Useful amounts of genuine high-denomination German, Italian, and French currency, hidden within the piles of Monopoly money!
British and American air-crews were advised, before taking off on their first mission, how to identify a "rigged" Monopoly set ----- by means of a tiny red dot, one cleverly rigged to look like an ordinary printing glitch, located in the corner of the Free Parking square! Of the estimated 35,000 Allied POWS who successfully escaped, an estimated one-third were aided in their flight by the rigged Monopoly sets. Everyone who did so was sworn to secrecy Indefinitely, since the British Government might want to use this highly successful ruse in still another, future war.
The story wasn't de-classified until 2007, when the surviving craftsmen from Waddington's, as well as the firm itself, were finally honored in a public ceremony. Anyway, it's always nice when you can play that "Get Out of Jail Free" card.
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-Stina
From Sweet Grass to the Packin' House
A soft answer turneth away wrath: but grievous words stir up anger. -Proverbs 15:1
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/6/2008 4:00:56 PM
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HisCovenant
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That's amazing, Christina!
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/6/2008 8:38:46 PM
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lexie
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Christina - I just noticed in one of your earlier posts you were wondering about taxes that come out of our paycheque. Everyone gets two deductions here. One is CPP which is pension plan and the other is EI, all things unemployment (where our maternity benefits come from.) Other deductions depend on your job.
I don't know how health care is funded. It's easy to say it's sales tax, but there's a lot more to it than that. Health care is done provincially, but the federal government helps cover it. Obviously, with our sales tax there is more than just free health care.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/6/2008 9:13:11 PM
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nicole6598
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Yep same here Lexie in regards to the taxes. Although I don't know which tax pays for what. I am happy to pay taxes because our govt provides things for us in return. I don't see it as a negative to have socialised healthcare I see it as a blessing and I don't think I know of anyone else who has socialised healthcare that thinks of it negatively either. Our taxes go towards roads, free education all the way up to university (college), roads, public transport, children's services, free immunisations, plus a million more things. we have state govts who use some money we pay in state taxes which would be through our rates on our homes and car registrations etc that put money into all of that, and then the federal govt give the states money too.
Here all employers, with help from the govt, put money into a superannuation account for people when they retire. That doesn't come out of our pay, the business pays for that with help from the govt.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/7/2008 4:55:55 PM
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clag4christ
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quote:
ORIGINAL: nicole6598
Yep same here Lexie in regards to the taxes. Although I don't know which tax pays for what. I am happy to pay taxes because our govt provides things for us in return. I don't see it as a negative to have socialised healthcare I see it as a blessing and I don't think I know of anyone else who has socialised healthcare that thinks of it negatively either. Our taxes go towards roads, free education all the way up to university (college), roads, public transport, children's services, free immunisations, plus a million more things. we have state govts who use some money we pay in state taxes which would be through our rates on our homes and car registrations etc that put money into all of that, and then the federal govt give the states money too.
Here all employers, with help from the govt, put money into a superannuation account for people when they retire. That doesn't come out of our pay, the business pays for that with help from the govt.
Our taxes go to pay for roads, transportation things, military (defense), and many other gov't programs. But we don't have 'free' healthcare, nor 'free college' (though there are gov't. grants and you can get loans and scolarships). If you make under a certain amount per year you qualify for gov't programs that help with medical coverage, etc. I'm grateful that we don't have socialized healthcare because that means that the 'market' (as economists say) helps get us the best and most cutting edge technology. If our health care system was run by the State (Federal gov't.) it would be substandard (by our high standards here).
I understand that taxes are a part of life for anyone living under any gov't. But that being said, it's what your gov't. does with those taxes and how much they take from their people that's the issue. I prefer to have more of my own paycheck (or my husband's rather) and give to charitable organizations and pay for my own things than have the gov't. (a model of ineffeciency) take my money and decide what's best for me...how does a gov't. made up of people I've never met know what's in my best interests? It doesn't.
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<-----Jael as Tinkerbell - Halloween 2008
If you don't want people to insult your intelligence; don't make it so obvious that you have none.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/7/2008 5:29:37 PM
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HenriettasCat
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Clag, people with the money can still choose to have private healthcare, education etc if they wish. Some firms also provide private healthcare.
I have used both private (through my dad's insurance when I lived at home) and nhs services. I found nhs to be better. With both my babies I stayed for 5 days in a midwife unit and had wonderful care. Help to breastfeed (I'd only have to ring a bell and someone would come and help the baby latch on). They showed me how to bathe and change my baby, I had a physiotherapist every day (I'd had an episiotomy with my first). I had further visits at home from my midwife and following that home visits from my healthvisitor. That is a stark contrast to my friend in Texas who had a section and had to be out of the hospital within 36 hours (she paid something like $5000 for the privilage). It seems to me that Dr's in the US are far too eager to do sections as well. It could be argued that when a hospital is primarily business and profit driven the patient is no longer the priority?
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/7/2008 9:48:11 PM
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nicole6598
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I don't really think I have come across people who are kind of "anti govt" apart from Americans, not sure why that is, but I haven't. That's what you have voting for IMO. And we use the money that we do use how we want to spend it.
Like henrietta, I know people who have had private health and haven't had any better treatment than public patients. In face my very good friends mum is in private care at the moment, she has a possible brain tumour, it is taking a week to get a private doctor from one end of the city (30 min drive) to even come and visit her, so meanwhile they toss her out of hospital and the daughter who lives in town who is 5 months pregnant and has a broken leg has to care for her while they wait for the private doctor to come and see her. Its shocking. Their mum forgets conversations she had 5 mins ago, she forgets that she already ate dinner 20 mins ago, forgets that she has to close the door to the toilet.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/8/2008 12:34:25 AM
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Mrs.X
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Me niether Nicole. It seems like Aussies, Brits, Frenchies and Canadians seem to be fine. Every govt is at least messed up in some way, but ya'll don't seem to complain a lot about it.
In a speech one time Nixon gave about socialized healthcare he said something like, "Americans don't want socialized healthcare, it's a bad idea, just ask a Canadian." Well, I dunno the Canadians I know seem to be fine with it. I dunno maybe the Canadian healthcare was different back then. Or, it could be that he assumed the average American wouldn't talk to a Canadian about it and that it wouldn't get in the media that Canada's healthcare system is just fine.
I dunno.....why is the infant mortality rate worse in the States than it is in the UK, Aus and Canada if socialized healthcare is so bad. Maybe, I'm just biased because my teeth are rotting out of my head, and I don't have the money to fix it. I'm sure Canada, Aus and the UK have their rednecks, but at least their rednecks have teeth! LOL! If my teeth could get fixed at the expense of having an even BIGGER brother, I really don't care. I've got nothing to hide and the principle of it really doesn't bother me. What is freedom when you can't enjoy it because all your money goes to medical bills? And, it's not like the other countries aren't free, they are. It seems like every week when I watch Extreme Home Makeover, someone's house is falling apart because some member of the family is fighting cancer and they can't afford to fix their house because of medical bills. I see it all.the.time. My mom is 50 and has never had a mammogram. My husband hasn't been to a doctor in 15 years. Yes, we have made bad choices financially, but bad financial choices shouldn't = bad health. Everyone, regardless of their financial situation should have the freedom to see a doctor without making their finances worse.
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-Stina
From Sweet Grass to the Packin' House
A soft answer turneth away wrath: but grievous words stir up anger. -Proverbs 15:1
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/8/2008 3:58:34 AM
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HenriettasCat
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Mrs X, I'm sorry to hear about the troubles your family has. I agree, especially when it comes to health and education that it should be available to all. We are on a low income, we could earn more but I am on half time hours since having my children. My husband is extremely hard working but self employed and things are tough for him at the moment. My health has not been good and I am soooo glad that I do not have to worry about how many times we have been to the Dr's. I recently saw my GP and within 3 weeks I have been to he hospital for an ultrasound. Same with my son last year he had a constant cough which would not go away and she whisked him to hospital for a chest X ray. There are failings in our system but at least I feel that in principle my Dr is making judgements about our healthcare based on our need, not on what we can afford.
Since dental services have started to go private over here there are concerns. Thankfully children still get dental services free.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/8/2008 5:29:19 AM
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nicole6598
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Christina I am sorry for you too!! You make me realise what some people in my country take for granted, free pap smears, mammograms, immunisations, dental etc etc. My grandmother needed her eye operated on, I would hate to think what would happen if we lived in a country where we would have to pay for that type of thing.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/8/2008 7:25:33 AM
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manda59
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quote:
ORIGINAL: HenriettasCat
Since dental services have started to go private over here there are concerns. Thankfully children still get dental services free.
Our National Health dentist went private, but said that so long as my dh and I were with him (as private patients), he would treat our children still under the NHS.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/8/2008 8:42:21 AM
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lexie
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Dental isn't covered by the government here. Our provincial government is trying to work something out, but right now I'm paying out of pocket (and thus not going to the dentist unless it's an emergency.)
As for our healthcare system being bad, sure it has it's flaws and there is a lot of stress on it right now, but I wouldn't trade it for another. We haven't had private health insurance since we were students...and didn't have any through the pregnancy. In total, my pregnancy cost me $262. $250 to the obgyn for things that weren't covered by the health care (like doctors notes, etc.) $10 for some stupid birth journal the hospital gave me and $2 for a phone call I made while in the hospital.
When I filled out the forms, I had to request what room I wanted. There was standard (with 3 other ladies but free), semi-private ($200 a day) or private ($250 a day). Obviously I chose standard, but once I had given birth all of the standard rooms were full so they gave me a semi-private (which I had to myself for half the stay) at no charge (even though they technically could have charged me for it.)
My mom had breast cancer and one thing that was great about what we went through is we never had to worry about how we would pay for it. That was one big burden lifted off of our shoulders in such a hard time.
People outside of Canada always seem to know someone in Canada who HAD to go over the border to get their treatment. But as I say, it's like the Canadian equivalent of Michael Moore's Sicko...I'm sure you can find a couple of people, put them together, and make an entire country look bad.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/8/2008 11:17:48 AM
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agapetos
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I see a NHS dentist and he's wonderful. He joined his brother in partnership around the time I moved here so I hopped on his list. He's not able to take any more NHS patients now and if you miss an appointment (without good reason) you get booted. His brother died a couple of months back though, and it was a huge shock to them all ~ the receptionist had worked for him for nearly 20 years. They've got someone joining them in Sept/Oct fortunately.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/8/2008 12:29:24 PM
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Mrs.X
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Sorry Henrietta, I didn't mean for that to sound so "poor me". People with health insurance through their work just really don't understand what it's like to not have any. So, it's easy for them to knock socialized care. It seems like in all your countries, you can get health insurance through an employer if they offer it, so people over here really shouldn't have to worry about getting "substandard care" since they will have insurance through their work anyway. But, I'd take low-cost/free "substandard" health care over none. Although, I highly doubt it would be substandard as some Americans fear.
Nicole, anyone can get a free papsmear, STD testing and things like that at Planned Parenthood, as much as I hate using an organization like them. And, most people are able to get insurance through the governement for their children. Most pregnant women also qualify too. In some places there are volunteer hospitals and clinics. We have one just a few towns over, and they do things on a sliding scale based on your income. It's still too expensive though for some things. We'll be going there next month to get Robert tested for diabetes, and I think we'll probably only pay $50 for the appointment.
Lexie, see that amount would be totally doable. I did have "really good" insurance for both my pregnancies, so I only paid for the circumcisions. But, if I would have had no insurance, I certainly would have been able to swing $262 over thousands of dollars. I see what you're saying about Michael Moore. I did see that movie (I didn't really know ya'll had socialized healthcare until I saw it), but everything he said about Americans was true. Happens all the time. Denied because of a "pre-existing condition" or not having the money for prescriptions, etc. I imagine he probably played up everything about the other countries though. I will say the movie made me green with envy though.
_____________________________
-Stina
From Sweet Grass to the Packin' House
A soft answer turneth away wrath: but grievous words stir up anger. -Proverbs 15:1
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/8/2008 3:18:35 PM
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clag4christ
Posts: 2890
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We get a better quality of care here, imo, because of the competition (i.e. doctors needing to please their patients because if they don't they'll lose the income) as opposed to it being gov't. run and the doctors getting paid no matter what...do you see my meaning here?
Like you said Christina, there are programs and health options available for those that are low income. We don't have to have a completely socialized medical system for those 'less fortunate' to be taken care of.
Michael Moore doesn't deal in the truth...
Sicko Article
quote:
I don't really think I have come across people who are kind of "anti govt" apart from Americans, not sure why that is, but I haven't. That's what you have voting for IMO. And we use the money that we do use how we want to spend it.
I'm not so much anti-gov't. as I am anti-BIG gov't. I don't believe that the gov't. knows better than I do, how to spend my money, what to spend my money on, or how I should live my life. It really boils down to that...the more power you give to your particular gov't. the less free a person is.
< Message edited by clag4christ -- 8/8/2008 3:27:56 PM >
_____________________________
<-----Jael as Tinkerbell - Halloween 2008
If you don't want people to insult your intelligence; don't make it so obvious that you have none.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/8/2008 4:01:44 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
Posts: 5070
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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quote:
My mom is 50 and has never had a mammogram.
I would bet that your state has a free Mamo program.
quote:
People with health insurance through their work just really don't understand what it's like to not have any. So, it's easy for them to knock socialized care.
There are ALOT of people without health care, who aren't pro-socialized care. I have lived without insurance, we are getting ready to be without insurance, and I am still not in favor of a socialized program.
And... your kids DO qualify for the "socialized" programs we already have, and private healthcare is available for less then $100 a month for adults(which is actually less then we pay through Micah's employer).
quote:
but everything he said about Americans was true.
It actually wasn't all true. Part of what he showed was people being "kicked out" of hospitals and dropped off on the street, but a HUGE medicare/medicaid scam was uncovered showing that hospitals were paying homeless people and treating them for conditions they didn't have so that they could submit claims to medicaid.
quote:
I'm not so much anti-gov't. as I am anti-BIG gov't. I don't believe that the gov't. knows better than I do, how to spend my money, what to spend my money on, or how I should live my life. It really boils down to that...the more power you give to your particular gov't. the less free a person is.
Exactly.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/8/2008 5:08:50 PM
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clag4christ
Posts: 2890
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From: We just moved to the big state of Texas!
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For everyone's information...
Here in the US the top 1%, defined as those making more than $388,806, pay 40% of the personal income taxes, while earning only about 22% of the income. The top 10%, those making at least $108,904, paid 71%. But most striking is that the bottom 50% only paid 2.9%.
My husband and I would fall into almost the top 10% of wage earners...and we are not 'rich' by most people's definitions...shoot...we've got whole rooms empty of furniture, only one car, and we have to save for almost everything new we need or want! And granted $388,000 is a lot of money...it's not the annual income that most of the people here in the US would consider 'obscenely rich', so much so that they should be paying 40% of the taxes for the country!
Taken from HERE
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<-----Jael as Tinkerbell - Halloween 2008
If you don't want people to insult your intelligence; don't make it so obvious that you have none.
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RE: Question from a Brit to any Y... umm American - 8/8/2008 7:09:47 PM
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nicole6598
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Joined: 11/3/2006
From: Australia
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LOL Kim, not as good as us aussies :) especialy in the pool! aussie aussie aussie oi oi oi!
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