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ANTICHRIST - 4/6/2007 1:48:22 PM
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JohnWilliams
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There are only 4 verses in Scripture that contain the word antichrist. If you have doubts search the Blue Letter Bible (KJV quoted below):
1 John 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that [spirit] of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
In the KJV the word antichrist is not selectively capitalized, and there was no upper and lower case in the original text. Clearly, from the verses above, antichrist is a SPIRIT, or THE spirit, that lives in the heart of anybody that denies that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, or denies that Jesus Christ IS come in the flesh. Every man that denies the Son has not the Father and is antichrist, and also is an antichrist. Jewish blindness, however, is a separate issue as per Romans 11.
Since there are billions of antichrists - and no shortage from John's day forward - it would seem there cannot be a single antichrist - not in John's day - not today. An individual antichrist can only be just ANOTHER antichrist.
The following verse is sometimes understood to suggest an individual past or future "Antichrist", but Scripture shows us how to understand this verse perfectly:
1 John 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
How can we have a singular and plural antichrist in the same sentence? We can develop our understanding using hermeneutics by looking to another verse that also uses the term antichrist in a singular fashion:
1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that [spirit] of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
You can see the singular "that", "spirit", "it" in this sentence and singular "antichrist", just like the singular "antichrist" in 1 John 2:18. The translators gave us a little extra push in 1 John 4:3 by inserting the word [spirit] a second time, further clarifying that the spirit of antichrist is this singular entity. Now look at how this makes perfect sense in the "little children" verse:
John 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that [the spirit of] antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
Finally look also at how beautifully parallel these two verse snippets are:
"ye have heard that antichrist shall come"
"ye have heard that it should come"
Look at the fruit of misunderstanding. Some say "The" "Antichrist" was Nero. Perhaps suggesting "he" is over and done with. Futurists are looking for some future individual "Antichrist" of the silver screen yet to come. Others you can find on the Internet, of which there is no shortage, proffer guesses from the leader of Spain, to the Pope, to Ronald Reagan.
Meanwhile there are 1.5 billion antichrists in Islam alone. This doesn't even count the atheist neighbor down your block where your kids go to hang out. The Church has been deceived into looking in the wrong place. Has the Church's looking for some individual "Antichrist", past or present, also made it look like so much buffoonery to those outside of the Church?
It is human nature to want to believe in concepts such as "The" "Antichrist". What kid didn't take a flying leap to get into bed, so that what ever was under the bed wouldn't grab their ankles? Without the concept of a boogeyman Hollywood would go broke and the majority fiction novelists would be homeless.
But here is how Satan succeeded the most through this concept. The term antichrist has been removed from the Christian vocabulary except when used to describe some individual boogeyman. Who would casually refer to the atheist that lives down the block as an antichrist, yet wouldn't this be correct? How much more soul searching might that individual do if we did? Who have you heard refer to the 1.5 billion Muslims as antichrists? A term that should be a normal part of Christian vocabulary has been stolen by the enemy. Just ask the guy next to you in Church next Sunday "what is the antichrist?" to get an idea of how this term is understood in the Church.
Consider also that God likely had John write so much later than the others so that he could address the myriad of heresies that had already infiltrated the Church, even in John's day. Consider all of the "overcommeth"ing of Revelation Chapter 2. The above verses in effect saying "you've heard that antichrist is coming, but it's already here!". Even if there had been such a concept of a single antichrist in the Church, consider the wording: "ye have heard". Perhaps like "ye have heard that toads give people warts", but that doesn't mean that it's true.
Consider a similar verse:
Matthew 5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. 4 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
"The folly of interpreters has been to foretell times and things by this prophecy [Revelation], as if God designed to make them prophets. By this rashness they have not only exposed themselves, but brought the prophecy also into contempt. The design of God was much otherwise. He gave this and the prophecies of the Old Testament, not to gratify men's curiosities by enabling them to foreknow things, but that after they were fulfilled they might be interpreted by the event, and his own providence, not the interpreters', be then manifested thereby to the world. For the event of things predicted many ages before will then be a convincing argument that the world is governed by Providence." - Sir Isaac Newton
2 Timothy 4:3-4 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away [their] ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/antichrist.htm
_____________________________
God is truth, so how well a person serves the Lord is not based on how good he is at defending his doctrine, but on how willing he is to seek out and follow the truth. ~ Ellis Skolfield.
Please visit http://www.beholdthebeast.com
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/8/2007 7:25:05 PM
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shilohsfoal
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quote:
In the KJV the word antichrist is not selectively capitalized, and there was no upper and lower case in the original text. Clearly, from the verses above, antichrist is a SPIRIT, or THE spirit, that lives in the heart of anybody that denies that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, or denies that Jesus Christ IS come in the flesh. Every man that denies the Son has not the Father and is antichrist, and also is an antichrist. Jewish blindness, however, is a separate issue as per Romans 11.
You cannot exclude those who say Christ has not come in the flesh.
Jewish blindness may be one issue but from thier own words are they known.
1 thes 2;15-18
Who both killed the Lord Jesus,and thier own prophets,and have percecuted us;and they please not God,and are contrary to all men;
Forbidding us to speak to the gentiles that they might be saved,to fill up thier sins always;for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
But we,brethren,being taken from you for a short time in presence,not in heart,endeavoreth the more abundantly to see your face with great desire.
Wherefore we would have come unto you,even I Paul,once and again;but Satan hinderd us.
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/8/2007 11:45:47 PM
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lecoop
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2 Thessalonians 2:3
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 [The man of sin]Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he [the man of sin] as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he [the man of sin] might be revealed in his time.
8 And then shall that Wicked [man of sin] be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, [the man of sin] whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
So who is this "man of sin?" John discribes him perfectly.
Revelation 13
1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Coop
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 7:45:38 AM
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JohnWilliams
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
2 Thessalonians 2:3
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 [The man of sin]Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he [the man of sin] as God sitteth in the temple of God,
1 Corinthians 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and [that] the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/man_of_sin.htm
quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
shewing himself that he is God.
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he [the man of sin] might be revealed in his time.
8 And then shall that Wicked [man of sin] be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, [the man of sin] whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
So who is this "man of sin?" John discribes him perfectly.
Only as a silver screen boogeyman through John Darby's misinterpretation. Where does the bible change the definition of a beast? quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
Revelation 13
1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast
rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
2 And the beast
Daniel 7:23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth,.....
BEAST = KINGDOM And Daniel defined it in the context of the very same leopard, bear and lion beasts.
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/the_beast.htm
quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Coop
_____________________________
God is truth, so how well a person serves the Lord is not based on how good he is at defending his doctrine, but on how willing he is to seek out and follow the truth. ~ Ellis Skolfield.
Please visit http://www.beholdthebeast.com
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 7:52:12 AM
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JohnWilliams
Posts: 57
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quote:
ORIGINAL: shilohsfoal
Jewish blindness may be one issue
God Himself gave the Jews blindness even after the Cross.
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/antichrist.htm#jewish_blindness
_____________________________
God is truth, so how well a person serves the Lord is not based on how good he is at defending his doctrine, but on how willing he is to seek out and follow the truth. ~ Ellis Skolfield.
Please visit http://www.beholdthebeast.com
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 4:55:47 PM
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shilohsfoal
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quote:
ORIGINAL: JohnWilliams
quote:
ORIGINAL: shilohsfoal
Jewish blindness may be one issue
God Himself gave the Jews blindness even after the Cross.
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/antichrist.htm#jewish_blindness
They are still antichrist who say Christ has not come.That is the point I tryed to make.
But as for thier blindness.Theyve been blind for far longer than 2000 years.In fact God said that he had not caused thier eyes to see or thier ears to hear while Moses was leading them through the wilderness.
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 5:00:28 PM
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JohnWilliams
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quote:
ORIGINAL: shilohsfoal
quote:
ORIGINAL: JohnWilliams
quote:
ORIGINAL: shilohsfoal
Jewish blindness may be one issue
God Himself gave the Jews blindness even after the Cross.
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/antichrist.htm#jewish_blindness
They are still antichrist who say Christ has not come.That is the point I tryed to make.
But as for thier blindness.Theyve been blind for far longer than 2000 years.In fact God said that he had not caused thier eyes to see or thier ears to hear while Moses was leading them through the wilderness.
Perhaps I misunderstood.
I thought we were talking about Romans 11. Written in the Christian era. God gave the Jews blindness after the cross. Why?
_____________________________
God is truth, so how well a person serves the Lord is not based on how good he is at defending his doctrine, but on how willing he is to seek out and follow the truth. ~ Ellis Skolfield.
Please visit http://www.beholdthebeast.com
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 5:10:48 PM
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shilohsfoal
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No ,I just been talking about antichrists.You know those people who call themselves by the name of Israel who say Christ has not come.Paul referd to them as Satan.
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 5:16:27 PM
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lecoop
Posts: 199
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quote:
ORIGINAL: JohnWilliams
quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
2 Thessalonians 2:3
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 [The man of sin]Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he [the man of sin] as God sitteth in the temple of God,
1 Corinthians 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and [that] the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/man_of_sin.htm
quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
shewing himself that he is God.
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he [the man of sin] might be revealed in his time.
8 And then shall that Wicked [man of sin] be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, [the man of sin] whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
So who is this "man of sin?" John discribes him perfectly.
Only as a silver screen boogeyman through John Darby's misinterpretation. Where does the bible change the definition of a beast? quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
Revelation 13
1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast
rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
2 And the beast
Daniel 7:23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth,.....
BEAST = KINGDOM And Daniel defined it in the context of the very same leopard, bear and lion beasts.
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/the_beast.htm
quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Coop
Kingdoms have kings.
Daniel 2
38 And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold.
Why do you keep skipping over this?
2 Thes 2
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
Did Paul call it a "kingdom?" No, he called him a man.
Coop
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 5:29:35 PM
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shilohsfoal
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2 Thessalonians 2:3
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 [The man of sin]Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he [the man of sin] as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
Daniel 11;36
And the king shall do according to his will;and he shall exalt himself,and magnify himself above every god,and shall speak marvelous things against the God of gods,and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished;for that that is determined shall be done.
Sounds like the same man to me.
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 6:59:22 PM
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JohnWilliams
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quote:
ORIGINAL: shilohsfoal
No ,I just been talking about antichrists.You know those people who call themselves by the name of Israel who say Christ has not come.Paul referd to them as Satan.
Can I recommend you spend a little less time in the skinhead sites?
That is the synagogue of Satan.
_____________________________
God is truth, so how well a person serves the Lord is not based on how good he is at defending his doctrine, but on how willing he is to seek out and follow the truth. ~ Ellis Skolfield.
Please visit http://www.beholdthebeast.com
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 7:19:57 PM
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JohnWilliams
Posts: 57
Joined: 3/31/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
quote:
ORIGINAL: JohnWilliams
quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
2 Thessalonians 2:3
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 [The man of sin]Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he [the man of sin] as God sitteth in the temple of God,
1 Corinthians 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and [that] the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/man_of_sin.htm
quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
shewing himself that he is God.
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he [the man of sin] might be revealed in his time.
8 And then shall that Wicked [man of sin] be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, [the man of sin] whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
So who is this "man of sin?" John discribes him perfectly.
Only as a silver screen boogeyman through John Darby's misinterpretation. Where does the bible change the definition of a beast? quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
Revelation 13
1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast
rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
2 And the beast
Daniel 7:23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth,.....
BEAST = KINGDOM And Daniel defined it in the context of the very same leopard, bear and lion beasts.
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/the_beast.htm
quote:
ORIGINAL: lecoop
which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Coop
Kingdoms have kings.
Daniel 2
38 And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold.
Why do you keep skipping over this?
2 Thes 2
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
Did Paul call it a "kingdom?" No, he called him a man.
Coop
The man of sin is Satan, as I address in that thread. http://www.ibelieve.com/That_Man_of_Sin_the_Son_of_Perdition/m_2291614/tm.htm
You seem to base so much on your personal interpretation. In this case your emphasis on the term "him". I suppose you got that one while in the closet with your bible too.
From the same guy that defined beast for us:
Dan 7:19 Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth [were of] iron, and his nails [of] brass; [which] devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;
Or try this from the word for word Greek Textus Receptus interlinear (sorry the software doesn't support the Greek font):
(Greek/English Interlinear (tr) NT) Revelation 13:1 | (12-18) kai <2532> {AND} estaqhn <2476> (5681) {I STOOD} epi <1909> {UPON} thn <3588> {THE} ammon <285> {SAND} thV <3588> {OF THE} qalasshV <2281> (13 -1) {SEA;} kai <2532> {AND} eidon <1492> (5627) {I SAW} ek <1537> {OUT OF} thV <3588> {THE} qalasshV <2281> {SEA} qhrion <2342> {A BEAST} anabainon <305> (5723) {RISING} econ <2192> (5723) {HAVING,} kefalaV <2776> {HEADS} epta <2033> {SEVEN} kai <2532> {AND} kerata <2768> {HORNS} deka <1176> {TEN,} kai <2532> {AND} epi <1909> {ON} twn <3588> keratwn <2768> autou <846> {ITS HORNS} deka <1176> {TEN} diadhmata <1238> {DIADEMS,} kai <2532> {AND} epi <1909> {UPON} taV <3588> kefalaV <2776> autou <846> {ITS HEADS} onoma <3686> {[THE] NAME} blasfhmiaV <988> {OF BLASPHEMY.}
Revelation 13:2
2 kai <2532> {AND} to <3588> {THE} qhrion <2342> {BEAST} o <3739> {WHICH} eidon <1492> (5627) {I SAW} hn <2258> (5713) {WAS} omoion <3664> {LIKE} pardalei <3917> {TO A LEOPARD,} kai <2532> oi <3588> {AND} podeV <4228> {FEET} autou <846> {ITS} wV <5613> {AS} arktou <715> {OF A BEAR,} kai <2532> {AND} to <3588> stoma <4750> autou <846> {ITS MOUTH} wV <5613> {AS [THE]} stoma <4750> {MOUTH} leontoV <3023> {OF A LION;} kai <2532> {AND} edwken <1325> (5656) {GAVE} autw <846> {TO IT} o <3588> {THE} drakwn <1404> {DRAGON} thn <3588> dunamin <1411> autou <846> {HIS POWER,} kai <2532> ton <3588> {AND} qronon <2362> {THRONE} autou <846> {HIS,} kai <2532> {AND} exousian <1849> {AUTHORITY} megalhn <3173> {GREAT.}
Much as you would like to create doctrine from your 20th century Western English speaking cloisterering in the closet, it obviously remains uninspired.
_____________________________
God is truth, so how well a person serves the Lord is not based on how good he is at defending his doctrine, but on how willing he is to seek out and follow the truth. ~ Ellis Skolfield.
Please visit http://www.beholdthebeast.com
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 7:51:15 PM
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rgmorga
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Where did Paul refer to the Jews as Satan? Paul was a Jew himself and not all Jews of today are antichrist some are saved. Why would Paul refer to the Jews as Satan when he said all of Isreal would be saved?
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 7:53:48 PM
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shilohsfoal
Posts: 25
Joined: 2/15/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: JohnWilliams
quote:
ORIGINAL: shilohsfoal
No ,I just been talking about antichrists.You know those people who call themselves by the name of Israel who say Christ has not come.Paul referd to them as Satan.
Can I recommend you spend a little less time in the skinhead sites?
That is the synagogue of Satan.
Can I recommend you keep your recommendations to yourself?
(Those who say Christ has not come )was taken from the scriptures ,not a skin head site.
John 4;3
And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God;and this is that spirit of antichrist,whereof ye have heard that it should come;and even now already is in the world.
I just need look whos mouth it comes out of.As for Mohammed.He claimed that Jesus is the Christ.
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 8:04:26 PM
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shilohsfoal
Posts: 25
Joined: 2/15/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rgmorga
Where did Paul refer to the Jews as Satan? Paul was a Jew himself and not all Jews of today are antichrist some are saved. Why would Paul refer to the Jews as Satan when he said all of Isreal would be saved?
quote:
1 thes 2;15-18
Who both killed the Lord Jesus,and thier own prophets,and have percecuted us;and they please not God,and are contrary to all men;
Forbidding us to speak to the gentiles that they might be saved,to fill up thier sins always;for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
But we,brethren,being taken from you for a short time in presence,not in heart,endeavoreth the more abundantly to see your face with great desire.
Wherefore we would have come unto you,even I Paul,once and again;but Satan hinderd us.
Notice Paul said Satan hinderd us after speaking of those who forbid them to speak to the gentiles.The same killed the Lord Jesus and thier own prophets.Who do you think Paul is speaking of here?
Just because someone calls themself a jew doesnt mean that they are.Read rev 2;9. and 3;9
Now if you want to know what a jew is read rom 2;28-29.
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 8:39:39 PM
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JohnWilliams
Posts: 57
Joined: 3/31/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: shilohsfoal
quote:
ORIGINAL: JohnWilliams
quote:
ORIGINAL: shilohsfoal
No ,I just been talking about antichrists.You know those people who call themselves by the name of Israel who say Christ has not come.Paul referd to them as Satan.
Can I recommend you spend a little less time in the skinhead sites?
That is the synagogue of Satan.
Can I recommend you keep your recommendations to yourself?
(Those who say Christ has not come )was taken from the scriptures ,not a skin head site.
John 4;3
And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God;and this is that spirit of antichrist,whereof ye have heard that it should come;and even now already is in the world.
I just need look whos mouth it comes out of.As for Mohammed.He claimed that Jesus is the Christ.
Your antisemitic bent prevents you from seeing the truth. Islam claims that Jesus WAS the christ. "a spirit proceeding from him". DID come in the flesh. Not IS come in the flesh.
The Jews were and are looking for the Messiah. The Jews believe in Yahweh. The Lord has simply blinded them from recognizing that Jesus is their Messiah. The enemy is clouding your vision. Christians and Jews are the two witnesses before Yahweh, just like so many of those before us confirm. Please read this one chapter. It works OK even out of context: http://www.beholdthebeast.com/timeless_covenant.htm
An atheist, secular historian, Muslim, evil spirit speaking in tongues through a Christian, or anyone else, must necessarily claim that Jesus WAS the Christ, because the historical record is too compelling. You joined their camp with your comment.
_____________________________
God is truth, so how well a person serves the Lord is not based on how good he is at defending his doctrine, but on how willing he is to seek out and follow the truth. ~ Ellis Skolfield.
Please visit http://www.beholdthebeast.com
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 8:44:21 PM
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JohnWilliams
Posts: 57
Joined: 3/31/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: shilohsfoal
quote:
ORIGINAL: rgmorga
Where did Paul refer to the Jews as Satan? Paul was a Jew himself and not all Jews of today are antichrist some are saved. Why would Paul refer to the Jews as Satan when he said all of Isreal would be saved?
quote:
1 thes 2;15-18
Who both killed the Lord Jesus,and thier own prophets,and have percecuted us;and they please not God,and are contrary to all men;
Forbidding us to speak to the gentiles that they might be saved,to fill up thier sins always;for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
But we,brethren,being taken from you for a short time in presence,not in heart,endeavoreth the more abundantly to see your face with great desire.
Wherefore we would have come unto you,even I Paul,once and again;but Satan hinderd us.
Notice Paul said Satan hinderd us after speaking of those who forbid them to speak to the gentiles.The same killed the Lord Jesus and thier own prophets.Who do you think Paul is speaking of here?
Just because someone calls themself a jew doesnt mean that they are.Read rev 2;9. and 3;9
Now if you want to know what a jew is read rom 2;28-29.
The problem with skinhead sites is they don't distinguish between the believing Jews and the secular Jews.
Even the Hebrew dictionary used for most modern bible versions is written by Gerhard Kittel. Satan is in the church whether we want to believe it or not.
_____________________________
God is truth, so how well a person serves the Lord is not based on how good he is at defending his doctrine, but on how willing he is to seek out and follow the truth. ~ Ellis Skolfield.
Please visit http://www.beholdthebeast.com
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 8:48:38 PM
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shilohsfoal
Posts: 25
Joined: 2/15/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
The problem with skinhead sites is they don't distinguish between the believing Jews and the secular Jews.
Noticed I directed the person to Paul for instruction.Are refering to Paul as a skinhead or was you calling John a skinhead?
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 8:51:32 PM
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JohnWilliams
Posts: 57
Joined: 3/31/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rgmorga
Where did Paul refer to the Jews as Satan? Paul was a Jew himself and not all Jews of today are antichrist some are saved. Why would Paul refer to the Jews as Satan when he said all of Isreal would be saved?
May God richly bless you rgmorga. But were Jews "born again" even before the Cross? Please read this chapter and let me know what you think: http://www.beholdthebeast.com/timeless_covenant.htm
_____________________________
God is truth, so how well a person serves the Lord is not based on how good he is at defending his doctrine, but on how willing he is to seek out and follow the truth. ~ Ellis Skolfield.
Please visit http://www.beholdthebeast.com
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 8:53:38 PM
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shilohsfoal
Posts: 25
Joined: 2/15/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
An atheist, secular historian, Muslim, evil spirit speaking in tongues through a Christian, or anyone else, must necessarily claim that Jesus WAS the Christ, because the historical record is too compelling. You joined their camp with your comment.
I suppose Peter did also when he said Jesus is the Christ.
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/9/2007 8:59:09 PM
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shilohsfoal
Posts: 25
Joined: 2/15/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
The Jews were and are looking for the Messiah.
Very ,very few.
Those that seek,find.
Those that ask,recieve.
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/10/2007 7:40:08 AM
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JohnWilliams
Posts: 57
Joined: 3/31/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: shilohsfoal
quote:
An atheist, secular historian, Muslim, evil spirit speaking in tongues through a Christian, or anyone else, must necessarily claim that Jesus WAS the Christ, because the historical record is too compelling. You joined their camp with your comment.
I suppose Peter did also when he said Jesus is the Christ.
Yes, the operative word is "IS". I should have said you inadvertently joined their camp, I'm sorry for that.
Let me give you a more graphic example. The bible tells us that spirits should be tested because they are not all of God. When a Christian is talking in tongues, and the spirit is tested, sometimes it is found to be an unclean spirit (man of sin sitteth in the temple of God). This is why there is a requirement to test them (the spirit, not the person speaking).
1Jo 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
When tested, an unclean spirit will readily admit that "Jesus DID (WAS OR HAS) come in the flesh". Or he might say something like "I am he". What an unclean spirit cannot say is that Jesus Christ IS come in the flesh. Or if you have him say something like he the spirit of Jesus Christ who died on the Cross and was risen in the flesh and ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father, unclean spirits can't do it.
1Jo 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
1Jo 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that [spirit] of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
_____________________________
God is truth, so how well a person serves the Lord is not based on how good he is at defending his doctrine, but on how willing he is to seek out and follow the truth. ~ Ellis Skolfield.
Please visit http://www.beholdthebeast.com
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RE: ANTICHRIST - 4/10/2007 7:29:16 PM
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lecoop
Posts: 199
Joined: 11/5/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
The man of sin is Satan, as I address in that thread. http://www.ibelieve.com/That_Man_of_Sin_the_Son_of_Perdition/m_2291614/tm.htm
You seem to base so much on your personal interpretation. In this case your emphasis on the term "him". I suppose you got that one while in the closet with your bible too.
From the same guy that defined beast for us:
Dan 7:19 Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth [were of] iron, and his nails [of] brass; [which] devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;
Or try this from the word for word Greek Textus Receptus interlinear (sorry the software doesn't support the Greek font):
...
Much as you would like to create doctrine from your 20th century Western English speaking cloisterering in the closet, it obviously remains uninspired.
One thing I have noticed: you keep referring to some website, rather than the scriptures. You seem very established in what you believe. That is good - if it is the truth.
You said,
quote:
The man of sin is Satan, as I address in that thread.
Sorry, but that is just your opinion, and it is wrong. Let's look at the places whe | | |
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